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Post by cervyy on May 4, 2006 23:42:59 GMT -5
Okay, question. I remember when Jesse was at Oz he fielded a question about God and the answer was that he was a spirit. So, if we're made in God's image ... then does that refer to us physically, mentally and soulfully (I think i made up a word) or both?? Because if you think about there is quite a diverse collection of people who can look nothing alike or think nothing alike. So if we assume that God has no real form, then he didn't create us in his image physically. What do the Bible thumpers say?? This question really makes me think, but I'm just not sure.
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Post by Jesse Morrell on May 4, 2006 23:47:01 GMT -5
Often the question seems to come up, "Why do you always refer to God as he? Maybe God is a she!"
It's really rediculous. For starters the bible always refers to God as He, however God is not really male nor female. Male and females are catagorized soley by their physical bodies. However God is Spirit and when we die we too will be Spirit, hense no marriage in Heaven.
However we were spiritually created in the image of God, not physically.
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Post by cervyy on May 4, 2006 23:51:55 GMT -5
spiritually was the word I wanted to put instead of mentally/soulfully, but I did not feel it expressed it best.
by spiritually you mean soul of course (i assume) which ... well, another question then. What is the soul to us? Is it us, just noncorpreal?
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Post by HSTN2983 on May 5, 2006 6:41:03 GMT -5
jesse also forgot to mention, and i know he knows this, but god is defined as a [he] because jewish culture is built on a patriarchal society. in other words, it is a society in which males take a leadership role. jesse is right on the biblical interpretation that god is neither he or she, but a spirit.
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Post by cervyy on May 5, 2006 18:41:09 GMT -5
Jess, you didn't answer my question!!
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Post by HSTN2983 on May 5, 2006 19:14:51 GMT -5
haha. i want to apologize for not answering the question, because i went solely on jesse's answer. oi. sometimes he does not answer, or avoids the question altogether. there is a lot a debate concerning whether we are creatures created in god's physical image. however, i tend to interpret as we were created of equal stature, with similar mental and spiritual qualities. in other words, all the humans god created have the same potential. you see, i think 'created in god's image' is simply another way of saying , i have an idea!' god created humans with a specific purpose in mind, and this is the image spoken of in the bible. i doubt that humans and metaphysical beings share any physical characteristics with a metaphysical being. this is why western civilization has the misconception that god is an old dude with a beard, and that jesus is a white guy. we are human, cervyy, we rely on our senses and only on things that we know. we give meaning to the metaphysical, or the unknown realm, by creating it 'in our image.'
do you understand?
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Post by cervyy on May 5, 2006 19:42:30 GMT -5
yup
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Post by HSTN2983 on May 6, 2006 9:57:46 GMT -5
i wonder if god would have been such a homocidal, egotistical maniac if 'he' were a 'she.'
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Post by cervyy on May 10, 2006 21:38:46 GMT -5
Okay, this was the original reason I posed this question, so I could lead up to this after I heard a few things (but I had an ADD moment that lasted for days).
So, our souls make up who we are. In a body we have form, but the spirit we posses beneath the flesh is US, really our tried and true form. So, in that genderless state, things like gay and straight don't exist. Gender is MEANINGLESS to the spirit because it has none ...
That would seem to me to mean that if it is meaningless to the spirit, just by being in a body it suddenly puts unnatural restrictions on the spirit.
SO, by being one sex when you do the dirty with the opposite sex you get baby, but when you do it with the same sex, no baby. To me, that seems to be the only thing that matters. Either baby or no baby.
So why does the Bible say do it with the opposite? Well back then vountires were still growing and strugling to simply be. Peoples had not the people to create a thriving society. Therefor the ban on gay sex was put there to encourage the population of the species!
Feel free to say 'No, Cervy, yer stupid! That goes against the Bible! You stupid for suggesting something that goes against the Bible!! Become a drone like us!!!!'
I await ...
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Post by justaman on May 11, 2006 23:52:59 GMT -5
If God were a female, then the world wouldn't be this messed up... messy men... XD
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Post by cervyy on May 11, 2006 23:55:28 GMT -5
or if God were gay at least the world would be decorated nicely ... though I do think sometimes God did a superb job with nature, sometimes too beautiful for words .... hmmmm
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Post by justaman on May 12, 2006 1:50:36 GMT -5
Eh... I always felt that if He did make us in his image, then He did make us incomplete purposely, which is what makes us have flaws.
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Post by cervyy on May 12, 2006 9:17:52 GMT -5
God made as all how he wanted. I'm the way he wanted, I grew up the way he wanted me to. Same for you. It's really simple, people just get it all messed up sometimes.
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Post by Morluna on May 13, 2006 2:26:46 GMT -5
I think it's referring to our consciousness and awareness of the world and the universe, the higher thinking that seperates us from other animals. Not our physical bodies. I agree that God has no gender, male or female.
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Post by cervyy on May 13, 2006 17:46:01 GMT -5
And this is why I then have an issue with being gay wrong ... it makes no sense relgiously when you look at this whole important aspect!
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Post by orchid on May 13, 2006 18:18:48 GMT -5
Male and females are catagorized soley by their physical bodies. In fact, males and females are not separated merely by their bodies. There are many mental differences between the genders. There is scientific evidence (not that you care) that shows that men and women's brains react differently to certain stimulai. Remember that the bible was written by MEN who believed that WOMEN were inferior creatures and should be treated as servants.
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Post by Morluna on May 13, 2006 20:31:11 GMT -5
"There is scientific evidence (not that you care) that shows that men and women's brains react differently to certain stimulai."
Yeah, and a few decades back there were "scientific studies" that proved Africans' brain capacity was 3 times smaller than white man's.
I'm not sure I would trust those studies... I think more research is needed, but personally, I am of the opinion that there is little difference. But I'll just wait and see, I guess.
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Post by cervyy on May 13, 2006 20:37:56 GMT -5
Male and females are catagorized soley by their physical bodies. In fact, males and females are not separated merely by their bodies. There are many mental differences between the genders. There is scientific evidence (not that you care) that shows that men and women's brains react differently to certain stimulai. Remember that the bible was written by MEN who believed that WOMEN were inferior creatures and should be treated as servants. People's brains react different then other people's brains ... sometimes most guys act one way and then most girls act anohter, but there is nothing clear-cut or definate that can be made for one of the other mentally.
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Post by orchid on May 15, 2006 22:33:26 GMT -5
In fact, males and females are not separated merely by their bodies. There are many mental differences between the genders. There is scientific evidence (not that you care) that shows that men and women's brains react differently to certain stimulai. Remember that the bible was written by MEN who believed that WOMEN were inferior creatures and should be treated as servants. People's brains react different then other people's brains ... sometimes most guys act one way and then most girls act anohter, but there is nothing clear-cut or definate that can be made for one of the other mentally. If men and women's brains react differently, then that fundamentally makes them...different. Women's minds are created to react differently than men's minds. That's how the species survives. Opposites attract. If we were all the same...we would all be gay and that wouldn't be good for Jesse, Miles, and the rest of the gang now would it? I'm not debating the fact that men and women share similar qualities, but we are not defined simply by our bodies. There's more to the mind that pointless beliefs and dogma.
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Post by rebecca01 on May 15, 2006 22:50:17 GMT -5
I wonder why Eve was tempted first by the serpent? If Adam was tempted first to take a bite of the apple would he have taken it? Was Eve just punished because she was the first to take a bite of the apple?Is there a reason why the bible says women have to be submissive to their husbands other than the fact that Eve fell first?
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Post by Rodgers on May 15, 2006 22:52:51 GMT -5
For what it is worth, Paul says that women are more easily deceived than men. That is why they should sub,submitt and obey their husbands and why they should not be leaders in the church.
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Post by cervyy on May 15, 2006 23:01:03 GMT -5
I wonder why Eve was tempted first by the serpent? If Adam was tempted first to take a bite of the apple would he have taken it? Was Eve just punished because she was the first to take a bite of the apple?Is there a reason why the bible says women have to be submissive to their husbands other than the fact that Eve fell first? Rebecca, Eve just happened to be tempted, bad luck for her. Ya, she was the first to go against God, sucks to be her. but hey, if you wanna be some chovanistic pig's b*tch, that's yer problem and you'll regret it in the end. Have fun doing it.
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Post by rebecca01 on May 15, 2006 23:04:51 GMT -5
Well it doesn't quite work that way because if my husband steps out of line there is one bigger than he is!!! I would rather get in trouble with my husband than God! Ouch that hurts!!! ;D
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Post by cervyy on May 15, 2006 23:08:39 GMT -5
Well then ... contradiction much? Be subserviant (sp) ... but then go against husband ... opposites! I knew you had it in ya to be your own woman!!
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Post by Grant on May 16, 2006 5:26:54 GMT -5
To identify how we were created in His image, take a look at the three absolutes the Bible says about GOD:
- GOD is spirit... eternal, never created - GOD is love... good, perfect and holy - GOD is light... most wise, all knowing
His metaphysics are not the same as ours, so we know we aren't related to Him in that way. But His character, being good, perfect and holy, and creative, that is where we relate to Him.
He created us to be good, perfect and holy, in His image. We were given freewill which is the ability to create decisions, we have the capacity to be creative artistically which (by looking at the universe around us) is in His character.
So when we choose to NOT be good, perfect and holy, in the image that He created us to be in, (being HIS image), and we choose with our freewill to go against His nature, then we are saying we know better, we will do what WE want regardless of His purpose. We are then going against the nature of the universe itself since we are all a part of His creation, His plan. When we step out of His intended nature, we are no longer in His will and therefore offend His nature, GOD Himself. We violate the very foundation of Creation... we are responsible for our choices.
This is why we go where we best fit...
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Post by orchid on May 16, 2006 6:49:58 GMT -5
His metaphysics are not the same as ours, so we know we aren't related to Him in that way. But His character, being good, perfect and holy, and creative, that is where we relate to Him. You have absolutely no idea what you are saying. You speak in tongues and borderline riddles. God's character is perfect, but ours is not so we can relate to him? There are many pedophiles in the world, and I am not one of them, does that mean that I relate to them? God's perfect and I'm not and that means I can relate to him? I can't relate to someone who's had their arm amputated because I've never experienced that. I've never experienced perfection (aside from the occasional fornication) before, so there's no way that could be an excuse for why a God created me.
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Post by cervyy on May 16, 2006 8:54:56 GMT -5
That's the image in which he made us? That makes NO sense! I agree with what Orchid wrote above too
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Post by Grant on May 16, 2006 11:54:00 GMT -5
Didn't think you guys were that ignorant of Christianity, so I'll continue for your understanding...
You aren't in His image now... that's the point we have been making to you throughout our postings. By choosing to go our own way, we left that image and go on our own. But through Christ Jesus, we can become in His image again, made clean of our sin, righteous and holy. It is when we are born-again we become able to be transformed back to His purpose.
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Post by HSTN2983 on May 16, 2006 12:41:39 GMT -5
you can never be perfect, therefore you can never reach this image you speak so fondly of...
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Post by cervyy on May 16, 2006 12:47:49 GMT -5
You aren't in His image now... that's the point we have been making to you throughout our postings. By choosing to go our own way, we left that image and go on our own. But through Christ Jesus, we can become in His image again, made clean of our sin, righteous and holy. It is when we are born-again we become able to be transformed back to His purpose. Okay, we're NOT in his image even though the Bible says we are. Yet you also say "become in His image again," so when were we in his image before?
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