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Post by josh on Jan 30, 2007 0:51:35 GMT -5
This book is a must read! I am reading it now and I can hardly put it down. It does a great job showing the Sovereign God that we serve.
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Post by sean on Jan 31, 2007 1:01:04 GMT -5
This book is a must read! I am reading it now and I can hardly put it down. It does a great job showing the Sovereign God that we serve. I was thinking of getting this book and read this review on amazon.com. You seem to like the book (which "could" be a given considering it's from a Calvinist) but does this guys review hold any water to you? I ran across this book while searching for material relating to Free will and Predestination and their interplay (or lack thereof) which each other. It came highly recommeded so I bought it and read. It is very apparent that Mr. Pink has a deep passion for the pursuit of God and is a herald for what he believes to be the truth. His committment to Christ is above reproach. That said, however, he presents his arguments with less tact that I would expect from a person so intent on persuading people to subscribe to a certain doctrine. Instead of building a case and leading the reader to draw the intended conclusion desired (as C.S. Lewis wonderfully does) Pink seems to drag you across the dividing line between the two camps of thought and prevent from crossing over to the other side. There is little respect or empathy for arminianism in any form - it is treated instead like a disdained and sinful idea with the power only to corrupt and denigrate the minds of those who hear it. Specifically, he insists on maintaining the "Balance of Truth" between the ideas that God is both sovereign and man is responsible for his behavior but gives little real credence to the latter. His argument in the end boils down to merely asserting that man must be responsible even though it is logically inconsistent with his argumentation. Most disappointing of all, however, is his treatment of the problem of evil. If God is completely sovereign in the manner that Pink maintains then His control of evil is congruent to that sovereignty. It would have been understandable and even acceptable to merely say that God is both good and sovereign because Scripture maintains both but he goes on to attempt a solution and ends up destroying the little credibility the reader has left at that point. Finally, his insistence on avoiding the label "hyper-Calvinist" is a bit like someone downplaying the title "fundamentalist" merely because he does not like it - in both cases the vast majority of people would agree to the label despite personal opposition. In the end, Pink left me not so much a picture of a completely sovereign God but a God who operates only in the most carefully constructed of boxes.
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Post by tbxi on Jan 31, 2007 10:13:19 GMT -5
From my own experience, there is little or no worth to Amazon comments. When they are "for" a book, they are often so positive they are unrealistic, and when they are "against", they can be slanderous.
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Post by sean on Feb 14, 2007 11:20:29 GMT -5
From my own experience, there is little or no worth to Amazon comments. When they are "for" a book, they are often so positive they are unrealistic, and when they are "against", they can be slanderous. I bought the book anyway. I can't believe I have a book by a Calvinist called "The Sovereignty of God" sitting on my counter. I'll let you know what I think when I'm done.
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Post by sean on Feb 14, 2007 23:15:41 GMT -5
I've finished reading the first four chapters of this book and want to make some comments. Some of the things Pink says are good but others seem pretty weak and contradictory.
Let me point out a few things I've notice and you can comment on them.
NUMBER 1
In the Chapter titled "The Sovereignty of God in Administration" Pink's goal is to show that God's hand controls all things.
Here is His proof of this truth on page 35:
"Take the work of the post-office. Suppose that everybody decided to write letters on Mondays only, could the authorities cope with the mail on Tuesdays? and how would they occupy their time the balance of the week? So again with the storekeepers. What would happen if every housewife did her shopping on Wednesday, and stayed at home the rest of the week? But instead of such things happening, farmers in different countries both raise sufficient cattle and grow enough grain of various kinds to supply the almost incalculable needs of the human race; the mails are almost evenly distributed over the six days of the week; and some women shop on Monday, some on Tuesday, and so on. Do not these things clearly evidence the overruling and controlling hand of God!.
Now I don't doubt the overruling hand of God. It's plain from scripture. But these examples used to prove his point seem ridiculous. Because women don't shop on the same day and because mail is delivered every day? Come on!? There are not the type of arguments I would expect to find from someone trying to write a book about the Sovereignty of God.
NUMBER 2
In the Chapter titled "The Sovereignty of God in Salvation" Pink contradicts himself by applying a standard to one part of a text and not to all of the text. Pink builds upon the theme that all whom God wants to be saved will be saved. The elect are predetermined and non can resist God's will. Whomever Christ died for will be saved (Period).
Pink says on page 66:
"Here, too, we are definitely informed that Christ died for "that nation," i.e., Israel, and also for the One Body, His Church, for it is into the Church that the children of God - "scattered" among the nations - are not being "gathered together in one." And is it not remarkable that the members of the Church are here called "children of God" even before Christ died, and therefore before He commenced to build His Church! The vast majority of them had not then been born, yet were they regarded as "children of God;" children of God because they had been therefore "predestined unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to Himself" (Eph. 1:4,5)"
So here Pink says that Christ died for "that nation Israel AND for the One Body, His Church". We have two people Christ died for....again...Israel the NATION and the CHURCH. Pink would assert that the Church will be saved and made up of all who were predestined but Pink fails to address why the NATION OF ISRAEL whom Christ died for was not saved. Under Pinks reasoning IF Christ died for the nation of Israel they too would all have to be saved. We all know they were and are not. So here Pink applies his theology discriminately as he pleases. He is not fair in the application of his understand of "who will be saved" to all scripture but seems to apply it to those that can back up his viewpoint.
NUMBER 3
I believe Pink is wrong in his understanding of what the Holy Spirit is here on earth to do.
In the same chapter as above on page 75 Pink says:
"But, it may be said, is not the present mission of the Holy Spirit to "convict the world of sin"? And we answer, It is not. The mission of the Spirit is threefold; to glorify Christ, to vivify the elect, to edify the saints."
Then on page 77 Pink says:
"Three things, then the presence of the Holy Spirit on earth demonstrates to the world: first, it's sin, because the world refused to believe on Christ; second, God's righteousness in exalting to His own right hand the One cast out, and now no more seen by the world, third, judgment, because Satan that world's prince is already judged, though execution of his judgment is yet future. Thus the Holy Spirit's presence here displays things as they really are.
Pink seems to try to down play what the scriptures say the Holy Spirit will do....which includes convicting sinners. He believes that by the Spirit just being in the earth, really since the day of Pentecost, this was fulfilled and accomplished. He does not seem to believe that the Spirit convicts mens consciences by directly ministering to them but that fact that the Spirit is in the earth means the scripture in John 16 was fulfilled and done.
These are just a few things I've come across so far. I would have thought that someone trying to write a book on the subject he is writing on would cover these matters more fully and not leave any lose ends that contradict what he is saying. We'll see what the rest of the book holds.
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Post by deltadom on Feb 15, 2007 8:20:19 GMT -5
you can get the complete works of a w pink on cd
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