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Post by Steve Noel on Mar 30, 2006 18:44:12 GMT -5
This is a link to an article entitled "Don't Hate Me Because I'm Arminian" that was published in Christianity Today. The author is Roger E. Olson and I think it would be very useful in getting a grasp on where the Arminian is coming from. www.rickburress.com/PDF/MensFellowship/Arminian.pdf
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Post by Jeff Fuller on Mar 31, 2006 1:04:02 GMT -5
Steve, I love you brother... you are my favorite Arminian friend! ;D ;D ;D
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Post by Jeff Fuller on Mar 31, 2006 1:10:56 GMT -5
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Post by Steve Noel on Mar 31, 2006 18:36:16 GMT -5
Jeff,
With such antics I'm probably you're only Arminian friend. And I don't even know you! ;D
Also, I hope that you don't think this is a genuine representation of Arminianism Jeff.
Did you read the article?
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Post by Jeff Fuller on Mar 31, 2006 23:02:21 GMT -5
I read the article Steve... I was just being tongue in cheek.
To be really honest, I enjoy talking with you via the MB's. As brothers in Christ, we get the wonderful opportunity to poke fun at each other while teaching people about both Arminianism and Calvinism at the same time.
I am grateful for all the serious posts and the humorous ones too. I love you brother and I'm happy to serve the Lord beside you...
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Post by SlowBro on Apr 4, 2006 12:57:53 GMT -5
I love you brother and I'm happy to serve the Lord beside you... Here here! We should all be priviledged to have men as zealous for the glory of God as Steve is. I've not seem him attack any hyper-Calvinist straw men (yet) and I've seen him do nothing but make the issues textual in nature. Thanks for sticking to the text! I've mentioned this before but most of my family are Arminian, and I fellowship with them. I have no hatred for them, I just disagree on a few points. OK, five points A messianic Jew once told me, "two Jews, three opinions." LOL Though I may disagree with some of his doctrine, we worship the same risen Savior and one day we will link arms and praise Him without end. Hallelujah! On that day we won't have any more doctrinal debates because we can just ask the Savior Himself ;D
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Post by SlowBro on Apr 4, 2006 13:29:49 GMT -5
I just have one point of contention with the article. The author says that Calvinists believe that "God's selection is in no way conditioned by the elects' lives or decisions." Something about that just rubbed me the wrong way. While technically true, the way he said it might lead a non-Calvinist reader to assume the Calvinist thinks salvation is not conditional at all, that we DON'T have to choose Christ.
Salvation IS conditional upon our choice!!
We hold that in the mystery of God's providence, He requires all men to choose Christ and yet Christ purchases the ability to choose for some. Responsibility is a completely diffierent animal than ability.
And because of effectual calling we would only ever choose Christ! Like a man in a desert would despise a fistful of diamonds for clear, cool water, once our eyes are opened and we are given a spiritual thirst, we despise the diamonds of sin for the cool streams of living water in Christ!
His statement was not entirely inaccurate, but it caused me to cringe.
For example, I am pro-life. My skin crawls when someone calls me anti-abortion. Not untrue, just misleading. My emphasis is not on removing someone's right but preserving someone else's right to live!
Aside from that, I liked the article. I was excited to see he went to a Nazarene camp, for that is where I first encountered Christ in a serious way. Two thirds of my family graduated from Olivet Nazarene University. Great grandpa AND grandma were Nazarene ministers. Dad's dad (grandpa) was a pastor, grandma worked at ONU as a secretary. Mom's parents were strong leaders in the Nazarene church. Dad and mom were youth ministers at ONU and the church moved them to Florida for ministry. My sister graduated from ONU. Aunts and uncles and cousins graduated from ONU. We're a Nazarene family!
So you have my word that I will never attack an Arminian, just his shoddy doctrine ;D ;D ;D
What a great way to close the article: Surely we can learn to work and witness and worship together again as we have done in the past. Even John Wesley and his Calvinist colleague George White field patched up their friendship before they died. Wesley preached at Whitefield's funeral. It was all to the glory of God and his eternal kingdom that he did.
Amen! Sola deo gloria! I loved how Wesley used the Law to bring the knowledge of sin. I WANT TO BE LIKE WESLEY! What a bold man of holiness. He is one of my heros.
Sola deo gloria, CD
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Post by evanschaible on Apr 8, 2006 12:54:58 GMT -5
It's funny, after all these years of thinking I was I calvinist, I realized through some tof the people here I was a phony. Four point calvinist, ha. I was an arminian all that time, I just didnt know it. Thanks guys.
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Post by SlowBro on Apr 11, 2006 13:08:21 GMT -5
Evan: If you mean jackjackson's two articles on the "pressing logic" post, please wait. I'm going to comment on them. You said you were "convinced," that he nailed it with his two articles, but his caracatures did not represent the traditional Calvinist view correctly (I'll explain soon) and so I think you should keep pressing with discernment.
Please keep praying about what God's truth is.
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