Post by josefurban on Apr 9, 2006 15:14:14 GMT -5
Hebrews 6:4-6: For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
What insight does everybody have into this passage of Scripture? How do you interpret it?
Here is what I believe:
1. It is very possible for a genuine saved (elect) Christian to backslide, fall into sin, and come back to true salvation upon true repentance (for example, Peter denying Christ, etc).
2. Once a Christian becomes pure and holy through obedience to God and the quickening of the Holy Spirit by the resurrection power of Christ, it is possible for him to reach a level of deep heart purity before God in such a way that he walks in a deep level of closeness and intimacy with God where the very nature and mind of Christ become his. He can grow so close to God that he "walks with God" just like Enoch did. In such a state, a Christian can walk in such holiness that it is impossible for him to backslide because he is walking in total submission to God and is utterly consumed with the burden of the Lord. He has been so transformed by grace to such a deep extent that he is completely enlightened and backsliding is so absurd to him that he cannot do it. His faith is so mature that he is kept by the power of God completely.
3. Once a Christian reaches this level of absolute heart purity and partakes of the transforming gift of grace and the power of the Holy Spirit in such a deep way as I attempted to explain above, and as the above passage of scripture describes, he cannot backslide. He can however, choose to willfully rebel against God and turn into an apostate, at which point it would be totally impossible to renew him again to repentance. Once he reaches a certain level of grace (complete salvation of heart, mind, and soul), to turn back would be to apostasize.
4. I believe this scripture in Hebrews applies only to those who have reached this level of deep heart purity and holiness before God and have partaken of grace to such an extent that they are absolutely, totally, and completely transformed by the grace of God into the very nature of Christ Himself. Considering this, if I had to estimate, 99.9% of those who backslide never reached this deep level of grace and they CAN be renewed again to repentance.
5. It is possible and commanded that all Christians strive to reach this level of deep salvation and total heart purity before God. To those who do, they are not yet perfect in every sense, but are perfected in love, and are "perfecting holiness in the fear of God (2 Cor 7:1) and they must continue to press on toward the mark of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus, forsaking those things that are behind, not considering themselves to have already attained, but pressing on and on, deeper and deeper, from faith to faith and glory to glory constantly. If one considers himself perfect, he is subject to pride and not humility and thus is not perfect. Thus, the perfected Christian in love will walk in humility and have the motto of Paul in this passage of Philippians.
6. A Christian is not finally saved unless he "endures to the end" and abides faithful even unto death.
7. Those who are not among the elect can receive a portion of the gift of grace and can be transformed by the Holy Spirit and then backslide or wilffully rebel against God and be damned in the end.
8. Entire sanctification is not attainable in this life, though it is the goal of every true Christian. We can all grow in the fruit of the Holy Spirit and we can all grow in godliness. I've never met a single Christian who could not grow in the fruits of godliness and in love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self control. However, perfect seperation from sin IS possible and should be the reality of every Christian. Those who sin are of the devil. We are to be dead to sin, freed from sin, saved from sin, and have dominion over sin. So "sinless perfection" is possible and should be reality in every true Christian's life, but perfect sanctification in the truest sense of the term itself is not possible.
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There's just some notes on my thoughts. Let's hear what everybody thinks. I've kind of wandered off track a little bit but it's all very closely related so interested in hearing what you all think. And these aren't my officially adopted views on this subject, just some notes on my thoughts so let me get that clear.
And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
What insight does everybody have into this passage of Scripture? How do you interpret it?
Here is what I believe:
1. It is very possible for a genuine saved (elect) Christian to backslide, fall into sin, and come back to true salvation upon true repentance (for example, Peter denying Christ, etc).
2. Once a Christian becomes pure and holy through obedience to God and the quickening of the Holy Spirit by the resurrection power of Christ, it is possible for him to reach a level of deep heart purity before God in such a way that he walks in a deep level of closeness and intimacy with God where the very nature and mind of Christ become his. He can grow so close to God that he "walks with God" just like Enoch did. In such a state, a Christian can walk in such holiness that it is impossible for him to backslide because he is walking in total submission to God and is utterly consumed with the burden of the Lord. He has been so transformed by grace to such a deep extent that he is completely enlightened and backsliding is so absurd to him that he cannot do it. His faith is so mature that he is kept by the power of God completely.
3. Once a Christian reaches this level of absolute heart purity and partakes of the transforming gift of grace and the power of the Holy Spirit in such a deep way as I attempted to explain above, and as the above passage of scripture describes, he cannot backslide. He can however, choose to willfully rebel against God and turn into an apostate, at which point it would be totally impossible to renew him again to repentance. Once he reaches a certain level of grace (complete salvation of heart, mind, and soul), to turn back would be to apostasize.
4. I believe this scripture in Hebrews applies only to those who have reached this level of deep heart purity and holiness before God and have partaken of grace to such an extent that they are absolutely, totally, and completely transformed by the grace of God into the very nature of Christ Himself. Considering this, if I had to estimate, 99.9% of those who backslide never reached this deep level of grace and they CAN be renewed again to repentance.
5. It is possible and commanded that all Christians strive to reach this level of deep salvation and total heart purity before God. To those who do, they are not yet perfect in every sense, but are perfected in love, and are "perfecting holiness in the fear of God (2 Cor 7:1) and they must continue to press on toward the mark of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus, forsaking those things that are behind, not considering themselves to have already attained, but pressing on and on, deeper and deeper, from faith to faith and glory to glory constantly. If one considers himself perfect, he is subject to pride and not humility and thus is not perfect. Thus, the perfected Christian in love will walk in humility and have the motto of Paul in this passage of Philippians.
6. A Christian is not finally saved unless he "endures to the end" and abides faithful even unto death.
7. Those who are not among the elect can receive a portion of the gift of grace and can be transformed by the Holy Spirit and then backslide or wilffully rebel against God and be damned in the end.
8. Entire sanctification is not attainable in this life, though it is the goal of every true Christian. We can all grow in the fruit of the Holy Spirit and we can all grow in godliness. I've never met a single Christian who could not grow in the fruits of godliness and in love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self control. However, perfect seperation from sin IS possible and should be the reality of every Christian. Those who sin are of the devil. We are to be dead to sin, freed from sin, saved from sin, and have dominion over sin. So "sinless perfection" is possible and should be reality in every true Christian's life, but perfect sanctification in the truest sense of the term itself is not possible.
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There's just some notes on my thoughts. Let's hear what everybody thinks. I've kind of wandered off track a little bit but it's all very closely related so interested in hearing what you all think. And these aren't my officially adopted views on this subject, just some notes on my thoughts so let me get that clear.