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Post by Jesse Morrell on Jan 24, 2008 0:25:54 GMT -5
A GREEK WORD STUDY ON IMPUTED RIGHTEOUSNESS
"...his faith is counted [logizomai] for righteousness" Romans 4:5
"...God imputeth [logizomai] righteousness" Romans 4:6
"...faith was reckoned [logizomai] to Abraham for righteousness." Romans 4:9
The Greek word here in Romans 4:5 for "counted" is "logizomai" and it also is translated "imputed" in Romans 4:6 and also as "reckoned" in Romans 4:9. So when it says that our faith is counted as righteousness, it means God counts our faith as righteousness, God reckons our faith as righteousness.
Again, notice what it is that is being imputed (counted, reckoned) as righteousness. It is not Christ's obedience transfered to us. It is our faith being imputed (counted, reckoned) as righteousness.
IS CHRIST'S RIGHTEOUSNESS TRANSFERED TO US??
It is passed off as Christian doctrine today that "Christ's righteousness is transfered to your account". But where does the bible ever explicitly and exactly say this??
My bible says, "his FAITH is COUNTED [imputed] for righteousness" Romans 4:5. It is our faith in the atonement, and not the righteousness of Christ, that is imputed (counted) as righteousness.
Notice how imputed righteousness is synonymous in the bible with forgiveness:
"...God imputeth righteousness without works, saying, blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered. Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin." Romans 4:6-7.
So imputed righteousness is when God considers our faith as righteousness, forgives us of all our past sins. It is when God does not hold our past sins against us but treats us as if we had always been righteous.
WHEN GOD LOOKS AT US, DOES HE SEE US OR CHRIST'S RIGHTEOUSNESS??
Another saying that is being passed around as biblical Christianity is, "When God looks at you, he doesn't see you as you are (in sin), He sees the righteousness of Christ instead". This also is not found in the bible.
What did God say to the Christian Churches in revelations? Did God say, "I see the righteousness of Christ"?? Nope. God said, "I know they works" (Rev 2:2, :29, 2:13, 2:19, 3:1, 3:8, 3:15)
I've never been taught by my bible that "Christ's righteousness is transfered to your account". Rather my bible teaches me that faith in the atonement is considered righteousness (Romans 4).
And I've never been taught by my bible that "When God looks at you, He doesn't see you, He sees the righteousness of Christ." Rather, my bible teaches me that that God does in fact "know they works" (Rev. 2, 3)
SOLA SCRIPTURA!
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Post by trustandobey on Jan 24, 2008 9:59:26 GMT -5
Romans 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
Jesse, It is by God's Grace, we have Faith even to Follow or choose Him.
Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God
Which Means it is Christ Righteousness [Gift] in us, for it is not our Works [righteousness], But the Holy Spirits Work.
Isaiah 26:12 LORD, thou wilt ordain peace for us: for thou also hast wrought [Worked] "all" our works in us
Or, Justified by His Power [Grace] in us. Inflow of Christ Righteousness [Power] = Outflow of Faith [believe [Do] His Promises. Ps 119:165] by His work in us.
Ephesians 1:6-7 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved. In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
Proof, Jesus did not use His Righteousness, to keep from Sin. He is our Exsample to follow In His Footsteps.
John 14:10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.
It was God the Father In Jesus, doing the Works. Not Jesus. His Faith was relying completly In the Father. Which is the Faith OF Jesus, Rev 14:12. Which we must have to survive the End times.
Ephesians 3:20 Now unto him that is able to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think, according to the power that worketh in us,
Proof that it is Christ Righteousness in us.
Matthew 6:33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
1 Peter 1:5 Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time
2 Thessalonians 1:11 Wherefore also we pray always for you, that our God would count you worthy of this calling, and fulfil all the good pleasure of his goodness, and the work of faith with power:
Jesus wants to impute His Chararcter [Righteousness] In us. To change our vile wicked heart and mind to His.
Romans 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove [Faith, Jesus in us] what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God
Justified by Faith, Shows Jesus Righteousness in us to have Victory over Sin and Satan.
Acts 26:18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.
What is the Fruit of faith. If ye Love Me, Keep my Commandments.
Obedience to the Will of God. Which by His Power [Grace],[Imputed Christ Righteousness] Gives us the Power to keep His Law, Renew our minds, Walk in the Law [faith] as Christ Walked in the Law, Which is the Fathers Work in us.
John 15:10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
Which is His Covenant:
Psalm 103:18 To such as keep his covenant, and to those that remember his commandments to do them.[Faith, Christ in us]
The Lord will, by our Faith, Putting our mind, thoughts on Eternal Things, [not the World] this which will strengthened our mind and will change our Character. 2 Timothy 1:7 For God hath not given us the spirit of fear [doubt]; but of power [Grace, through faith], and of love [John 14:15], and of a sound mind.[Rom 12:2]
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Post by Jesse Morrell on Jan 24, 2008 10:39:01 GMT -5
Yes it is through GRACE, not through Christ's obedience to the law, that we are saved.
Charles Finney argued that to say that we need the righteousness of Christ transferred to our account in order for God to justify us is the same thing as saying that we are saved by the law instead of by grace. But in this scenario, it is Christ's works of the law that justifies us.
But the bible says that we aren't saved by the works of the law at all (either our obedience or Christ's obedience) rather, we are saved by God's GRACE and MERCY through the cross when God forgives us our sins and sets aside our punishment.
Albert Barnes pointed out that the entire concept of a transferred character or transferred righteousness is absurd. Both Barnes and Finney argued that because Christ as under obligation to the law Himself, as the scripture says He was born under the law, then Christ needed to obey the law for Himself. And therefore it could not have been a work of supererogation.
Here's the way I see it:
1. If Christ was under obligation to obey the Law, His obedience could not be a work of supererogation and therefore could not be transfered.
2. If Christ was not under obligation to obey the Law, He could not have any righteousness to be transferred since He would have no Law he was obligated to obey.
So if Christ was under obligation to the law then His righteousness could not be transferred. And if Christ was not under obligation to the law His righteousness could not be transferred.
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Post by Jesse Morrell on Feb 1, 2008 19:46:55 GMT -5
We are forgiven through Christ's blood, not justified through Christ's obedience. Ultimately, to say that we need "the righteousness of Christ" to be "transferred to our account" in order to be justified is explicitly saying that justification is by works of the law and not by grace! This view of justification says that God does not justify us by His grace, but that God required the perfect obedience of the law in order to justify sinners. But the truth is that Christ's obedience, in shedding His blood, has made it possible for God to justify us by His grace and mercy. Grace and mercy comes through Christ's blood. Certainly Jesus needed to be the spotless lamb of God who voluntarily laid down His life, and in this way does His obedience play into our justification. Christ obeyed God in being spotless and Christ obeyed God by laying down His life. But His obedience is not transferred to our account. Rather, His obedience made grace and mercy possible to everyone. I have thoroughly enjoyed reading Finney's lecture on the doctrine of justification. He critiques the Calvinistic view of a literal transfer of Christ's righteousness. "The doctrine of a literal imputation of Adam's sin to all his posterity, of the literal imputation of all the sins of the elect to Christ, and of His suffering for them the exact amount due to the transgressors, of the literal imputation of Christ's righteousness or obedience to the elect, and the consequent perpetual justification of all that are converted from the first exercise of faith, whatever their subsequent life may be - I say I regard these dogmas as fabulous, and better befitting a romance than a system of theology." Charles Finney, (Finney's Systematic Theology, pg 372, Bethany House) You can read his full lecture on justification here: www.gospeltruth.net/1851Sys_Theo/st56.htm
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Post by Kerrigan on Feb 1, 2008 22:10:17 GMT -5
That's a good quote by Finney. I wholeheartedly agree with it...
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Post by Steve Noel on Feb 2, 2008 11:36:37 GMT -5
Jesse, If God considers are faith as righteousness then how do you understand what Paul wrote in Philippians 3:7-8? "But whatever things were gain to me, those things I have counted as loss for the sake of Christ. More than that, I count all things to be loss in view of the surpassing value of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them but rubbish so that I may gain Christ, and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith,..." (NASB) Here it is clear that faith is not considered righteousness but that righteousness is given to those who believe. We receive righteousness through faith or as the KJV says here "the righteousness which is of God by faith." Faith is the condition for receiving the gift of righteousness from God it is not the righteousness from God. Consider Romans 3:21-22, "But now apart from the Law the righteousness of God has been manifested, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe" (NASB) In Romans 5:17 Paul calls it "the gift of righteousness" (NASB) It seems to me therefore that faith is not considered righteousness by God but is the means by which we receive the gift of righteousness from God. The righteousness we receive is of God and from God, that is, it is an alien righteousness. It is given to believers as a gift. I believe this is what leads to the belief that this righteousness which is given to the believer is the righteousness of Christ. Comments? Steve
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Post by danlirette on Feb 2, 2008 11:47:45 GMT -5
Jesse, If God considers are faith as righteousness then how do you understand what Paul wrote in Philippians 3:7-8? "But whatever things were gain to me, those things I have counted as loss for the sake of Christ. More than that, I count all things to be loss in view of the surpassing value of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them but rubbish so that I may gain Christ, and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith,..." (NASB) Here it is clear that faith is not considered righteousness but that righteousness is given to those who believe. We receive righteousness through faith or as the KJV says here "the righteousness which is of God by faith." Faith is the condition for receiving the gift of righteousness from God it is not the righteousness from God. Consider Romans 3:21-22, "But now apart from the Law the righteousness of God has been manifested, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe" (NASB) In Romans 5:17 Paul calls it "the gift of righteousness" (NASB) It seems to me therefore that faith is not considered righteousness by God but is the means by which we receive the gift of righteousness from God. The righteousness we receive is of God and from God, that is, it is an alien righteousness. It is given to believers as a gift. I believe this is what leads to the belief that this righteousness which is given to the believer is the righteousness of Christ. Comments? Steve Amen! The righteousness we receive is of God and from God
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Post by rebecca on Feb 2, 2008 12:28:06 GMT -5
Jesse, If God considers are faith as righteousness then how do you understand what Paul wrote in Philippians 3:7-8? "But whatever things were gain to me, those things I have counted as loss for the sake of Christ. More than that, I count all things to be loss in view of the surpassing value of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them but rubbish so that I may gain Christ, and may be found in Him, not having a righteousness of my own derived from the Law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which comes from God on the basis of faith,..." (NASB) Here it is clear that faith is not considered righteousness but that righteousness is given to those who believe. We receive righteousness through faith or as the KJV says here "the righteousness which is of God by faith." Faith is the condition for receiving the gift of righteousness from God it is not the righteousness from God. Consider Romans 3:21-22, "But now apart from the Law the righteousness of God has been manifested, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all those who believe" (NASB) In Romans 5:17 Paul calls it "the gift of righteousness" (NASB) It seems to me therefore that faith is not considered righteousness by God but is the means by which we receive the gift of righteousness from God. The righteousness we receive is of God and from God, that is, it is an alien righteousness. It is given to believers as a gift. I believe this is what leads to the belief that this righteousness which is given to the believer is the righteousness of Christ. Comments? Steve We could expound forever on that one. The righteousness of God in us is the absence of ourselves. The more of us we give to God the more of His righteousness we gain.
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mattmahar
Full Member
`Lo, thou hast become whole; sin no more, lest something worse may happen to thee.' John 5:14
Posts: 151
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Post by mattmahar on Feb 2, 2008 13:05:17 GMT -5
Bear with me I'm a little slow, but I don't see how what Steve said contradicts what Jesse said.
Could someone elaborate on this?
In Christ Matt
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mattmahar
Full Member
`Lo, thou hast become whole; sin no more, lest something worse may happen to thee.' John 5:14
Posts: 151
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Post by mattmahar on Feb 2, 2008 13:19:45 GMT -5
AMEN!
In Christ Matt
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Post by danlirette on Feb 2, 2008 13:36:42 GMT -5
We are forgiven through Christ's blood, not justified through Christ's obedience. Ultimately, to say that we need "the righteousness of Christ" to be "transferred to our account" in order to be justified is explicitly saying that justification is by works of the law and not by grace! This view of justification says that God does not justify us by His grace, but that God required the perfect obedience of the law in order to justify sinners. But the truth is that Christ's obedience, in shedding His blood, has made it possible for God to justify us by His grace and mercy. Grace and mercy comes through Christ's blood. Certainly Jesus needed to be the spotless lamb of God who voluntarily laid down His life, and in this way does His obedience play into our justification. Christ obeyed God in being spotless and Christ obeyed God by laying down His life. But His obedience is not transferred to our account. Rather, His obedience made grace and mercy possible to everyone. I have thoroughly enjoyed reading Finney's lecture on the doctrine of justification. He critiques the Calvinistic view of a literal transfer of Christ's righteousness. "The doctrine of a literal imputation of Adam's sin to all his posterity, of the literal imputation of all the sins of the elect to Christ, and of His suffering for them the exact amount due to the transgressors, of the literal imputation of Christ's righteousness or obedience to the elect, and the consequent perpetual justification of all that are converted from the first exercise of faith, whatever their subsequent life may be - I say I regard these dogmas as fabulous, and better befitting a romance than a system of theology." Charles Finney, (Finney's Systematic Theology, pg 372, Bethany House) You can read his full lecture on justification here: www.gospeltruth.net/1851Sys_Theo/st56.htmWho's Righteousness then do you claim to hold? Your own or Christ's in you?
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mattmahar
Full Member
`Lo, thou hast become whole; sin no more, lest something worse may happen to thee.' John 5:14
Posts: 151
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Post by mattmahar on Feb 2, 2008 13:46:04 GMT -5
Christ in you but this is only granted by the Grace of God in repentance. It is not imputed to our accounts outside of repentance and faith.
As a Christian where there is faith there is always Grace. But Grace is also defined as the power given to teach us to deny ungodliness, to give us the ability to refrain from worldly lusts and to enable us to live soberly, righteously and godly in our Christian walk.
In Christ Matt
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Post by danlirette on Feb 2, 2008 14:06:17 GMT -5
Christ in you but this is only granted by the Grace of God in repentance. It is not imputed to our accounts outside of repentance and faith. As a Christian where there is faith there is always Grace. But Grace is also defined as the power given to teach us to deny ungodliness, to give us the ability to refrain from worldly lusts and to enable us to live soberly, righteously and godly in our Christian walk. In Christ Matt I wholeheartedly agree with this statement and definition... for we are saved by Grace through Faith... and it is because of this that we walk in the Righteousness of Christ rather than our own righteousness.
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mattmahar
Full Member
`Lo, thou hast become whole; sin no more, lest something worse may happen to thee.' John 5:14
Posts: 151
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Post by mattmahar on Feb 2, 2008 14:13:17 GMT -5
Christ in you but this is only granted by the Grace of God in repentance. It is not imputed to our accounts outside of repentance and faith. As a Christian where there is faith there is always Grace. But Grace is also defined as the power given to teach us to deny ungodliness, to give us the ability to refrain from worldly lusts and to enable us to live soberly, righteously and godly in our Christian walk. In Christ Matt I wholeheartedly agree with this statement and definition... for we are saved by Grace through Faith... and it is because of this that we walk in the Righteousness of Christ rather than our own righteousness. Amen and that's why I was confused because Jesse did say it was and is by faith and Grace. So I don't think Steve's statements contradict what he was teaching from my understanding of what is presented. In Christ Matt
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Post by danlirette on Feb 2, 2008 14:21:03 GMT -5
I was confused also; I believed Jesse was stating (and is stating) that we do not have Christ's Righteousness but only our own based on our Faith. Jesse, could you clarify; I'm most likely misunderstanding as is Steve etc etc
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Post by Jesse Morrell on Feb 2, 2008 21:48:17 GMT -5
There are two main historical views of imputed righteousness:
1. WE ARE TREATED RIGHTEOUS FOR CHRIST'S SAKE, BECAUSE OF HIS BLOOD
Because of Christ's obedience in shedding His blood, God can forgive us our sins and treat us as if we were righteous. This is a gift from God. This righteousness is synonymous with forgiveness. This righteousness is a gracious gift. God does not hold our past against us, God treats us as if we had always been righteous, God grants us all the privileges the righteous have. This is all done because of Christ's obedience in shedding His blood. Being treated righteous in this sense is entirely of grace through the atonement.
2. WE ARE TREATED RIGHTEOUS BECAUSE CHRIST'S OBEDIENCE TO THE LAW IS CREDITED TO US
Christ's active obedience to the law or righteousness is transferred to our account. This is not the same thing as forgiveness through the cross, this is Christ's obedience to the moral law. When God looks at us He doesn't see us, He sees the righteousness of Christ instead. Being treated righteous in this sense is entirely legal and by justice, not grace, it is through the law.
There have been Arminians who hold to both views, and there have been Calvinists who hold to both views. Neither view can properly be called "Calvinist" or "Arminian" since both have been held by both sides.
I hold to the former view and see serious problems with the latter. The latter view says that this righteousness is entirely an act of grace through the cross. The latter has nothing to do with the cross, but only Christ's obedience to the law. As stated earlier, the doctrine that Christ's righteousness or obedience needs to be transfered to us in order to be justified is the same thing as saying that we are justified by the works of the law (Christ's works of the law).
LET IT BE CLEAR
When understanding imputed righteousness (being treated as if we were righteous because of Christ's blood) these things should be kept in mind:
- Imputed righteousness is through Christ: the blood of Christ makes forgiveness possible. Imputed righteousness and forgiveness are synonymous, God forgives us and treats us as if we were never unrighteous. - Imputed righteousness is a undeserved gift: we don't deserve to be treated as if we had never sinned, we don't deserve this forgiveness, it is through mercy that our crimes are pardoned.
- Imputed righteousness is of God: it is God who forgives us and treats us as if we had never sinned. This righteousness comes from God, because of Jesus, and not because of ourselves or our own works.
- Imputed righteousness is by grace not law: it is by grace (His blood) not by Law (His obedience). This righteousness comes through the blood of the atonement and not through any obedience to the law.
But imputed righteousness is NOT that Christ's obedience is transfered to us. Christ was under obligation to God for Himself. It is impossible that His obedience would be a work of "superarrogation". It was His suffering on the cross, not His obedience to the law, which was a work of superarrogation and can be "transfered to our account". Christ suffered on our behalf, His suffering for our sins is credited to us, and we are freely justified by grace and not by works of the law.
ALBERT BARNES:
"This is, if I understand it, the true doctrine of 'imputation;' not that there is any transfer of moral character from us to the Redeemer, or from him to us, and not that God literally 'reckons' or imputes our sins to him as his, or his righteousness to us as ours, but that his work may be estimated as performed in the place and on the account of sinful men, and that in virtue of that we may be regarded and treated as if it had been performed by ourselves." Albert Barnes "The Atonement" pg 315
In other words, our sins were not literally transfered to Christ, but Christ was treated (on our behalf) as if he were a sinner. And Christ's righteousness is not literally transfered to us, but we are treated (on account of Christ) as if we were always righteous or as if we were never unrighteous.
In his commentaries on Romans 4 he said, "God imputeth righteousness. Whom God treats as righteous... forgiven, and whose sins are not charged on him, but who is freed from the punishment due to his sins. Being thus pardoned, he is treated as a righteous man. And it is evidently in this sense that the aposlte uses the expression 'imputed righteousness' i.e. he does not imputed, or charge on the man his sins; he reckons and treats him as a pardoned and righteous man." Commentary on the Romans, pg 105
In other words, imputed righteousness is when God pardons our crimes and treats us as righteous because of Christ's blood.
Again Barnes said, "Whose sins are covered... Are concealed; or hidden, from the view/ On which God will no more look, and which he will no more remember. 'By these words' says Calvin (in loco), 'we are taught that justification with Paul is nothing else but pardon of sin' Commentary on the Romans, pg 106
In other words, justification is synonymous with pardon or forgiveness, when our past is not held against us and we are treated as if we had never sinned.
And again, "Will not impute sin. On whom the Lord will not charge his sins; or who shall not be reckoned or regarded as guilty. This shows clearly what the apostle meant by imputing faith without works. It is to pardon sin, and to treat with favour; not to reckon or charge a man's sin to him; but to treat him, though personally underserving and ungodly (ver. 5), as though the sin had not been committed." Commentary ont he Romans, pg 106
In other words, imputed righteousness is when our sins are forgiven, when God treats us as if we had never sinned, as if we had always been righteous, and this is done because of Christ's blood.
Albert Barnes taught that imputed righteousness is when we are "treated as righteous" because of the cross of Jesus Christ. It was not that Christ's obedience to the law is transferred to our account.
CHARLES FINNEY:
Finney had the identical atonement view and imputed righteousness view as Barnes, namely that, the suffering of Christ substitutes the punishment of sinners, the atonement is a replacement for our penalty, and is done on behalf of us so that it is credited to our account. And on the basis of this vicarious atonement, we can be "treated as righteous for His sake" that is, we can be treated as if we had never sinned (forgiven or pardoned), as if we had never been unrighteous, and we will be treated (imputed) righteous because of the blood of Jesus Christ.
IN SUMMARY
Imputed righteousness is not that Christ's obedience to the law is credited to us and therefore God justifies us through the works of the law, but that imputed righteousness is when God forgives us our sins and treats us as if we had never been unrighteous because of Christ's shed blood on the cross, when we are treated righteous because of Christ's atonement.
Imputed righteousness is by grace (His blood) not by Law (His obedience).
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mattmahar
Full Member
`Lo, thou hast become whole; sin no more, lest something worse may happen to thee.' John 5:14
Posts: 151
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Post by mattmahar on Feb 2, 2008 22:09:06 GMT -5
Amen AND Amen!
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Post by Kerrigan on Feb 2, 2008 22:31:58 GMT -5
Amen Jesse!
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Post by danlirette on Feb 2, 2008 23:40:08 GMT -5
1. WE ARE TREATED RIGHTEOUS FOR CHRIST'S SAKE, BECAUSE OF HIS BLOOD Because of Christ's obedience in shedding His blood, God can forgive us our sins and treat us as if we were righteous. This is a gift from God. This righteousness is synonymous with forgiveness. This righteousness is a gracious gift. God does not hold our past against us, God treats us as if we had always been righteous, God grants us all the privileges the righteous have. This is all done because of Christ's obedience in shedding His blood. Being treated righteous in this sense is entirely of grace through the atonement. You still haven;t answered the intial question, however. Who's righteousness is imputed through the Blood of the Cross in your theological view? If God treats us as if we had always been righteous, through and because of the Blood of Christ (whcih I agree with), I ask: Who's righteousness do we walk in? 1- Our own? 2- Christ's?
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Post by Jesse Morrell on Feb 2, 2008 23:54:12 GMT -5
Is imputed righteousness our own righteousness or Christ's righteousness? The answer is neither. Imputed righteousness is not the obedience to the law which Christ rendered, neither is it our own righteousness or obedience. Imputed righteousness has nothing to do with the law, it has to do with grace.
A person is imputed righteous when God considers them righteous, that is, when God forgives a person by grace through the blood of Jesus Christ. As soon as a person puts their faith in Christ's atonement, God forgives them (i.e. imputes them as righteous) and they are treated as if they were never unrighteous.
Imputed righteousness is neither Christ's nor our own. But, as I already said, imputed righteousness only comes through Jesus Christ because imputed righteousness is forgiveness through His blood. It is only because Jesus shed his blood on the cross that we can be forgiven (counted righteous).
So nobodies righteousness is transfered to us. "Imputed righteousness" is neither Christ's obedience nor our own righteousness. Imputed righteousness is the forgiveness of God, when God reckons - imputes - or counts us as righteous by faith in Christ's blood.
The word "logizomai" is translated as "counted" in Romans 4:5, as "imputed" in Romans 4:6, and as "reckoned" in Romans 4:9. Imputed righteousness is not the righteousness of another transfered to someone, neither is it the righteousness of the person it is prescribed to, but it is simply when God counts a person as righteous, when God imputes them as righteous, when God reckons or considers them as righteous. It is simply when God forgives us through the blood of Jesus Christ.
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Post by Kerrigan on Feb 2, 2008 23:54:32 GMT -5
Dan, I think Jesse answered your question. Christ's righteousness is NOT imputed to us as the Scripture never says it is. We aren't given the righteousness of someone. It is called "God's righteousness" in Scripture because it is HE who considers us righteous based on conditions being met:
1) The blood shed of an perfect, sinless person
2) Repentance of sins
3) Faith in Jesus
4) Persevering until the end
God expects us to walk in righteousness after we become Christians, but it isn't "our righteousness" that saves us. It is the blood shed at the cross that saves us. It is only Christ's perfect blood that can provide the forgiveness of sins that we are in need of (Hebrews 9:22). Hope this makes sense...
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Post by Jesse Morrell on Feb 2, 2008 23:57:28 GMT -5
I just wanted to carry this post over from the previous page:
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mattmahar
Full Member
`Lo, thou hast become whole; sin no more, lest something worse may happen to thee.' John 5:14
Posts: 151
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Post by mattmahar on Feb 2, 2008 23:59:48 GMT -5
David Pawson had said "This is accurately portrayed by someone throwing a lifeline to a drowning man and saying 'grab hold of this and keep holding on tightly until I pull you to safety.I would maintain that no one rescued in this way would dream that he had saved himself or even made a 'contribution' which merited his rescue. He would be filled with gratitude towards his rescuer."
In Christ Matt
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Post by Kerrigan on Feb 3, 2008 0:01:22 GMT -5
David Pawson had said "This is accurately portrayed by someone throwing a lifeline to a drowning man and saying 'grab hold of this and keep holding on tightly until I pull you to safety.I would maintain that no one rescued in this way would dream that he had saved himself or even made a 'contribution' which merited his rescue. He would be filled with gratitude towards his rescuer." In Christ Matt I like that Matt...thanks for sharing...
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Post by danlirette on Feb 3, 2008 0:03:24 GMT -5
Is imputed righteousness our own righteousness or Christ's righteousness? The answer is neither. Imputed righteousness is not the obedience to the law which Christ rendered, neither is it our own righteousness or obedience. Imputed righteousness has nothing to do with the law, it has to do with grace. Imputed righteousness is neither Christ's nor our own. But, as I already said, imputed righteousness only comes through Jesus Christ because imputed righteousness is forgiveness through His blood. So nobodies righteousness is transfered to us. "Imputed righteousness" is neither Christ's obedience nor our own righteousness. Imputed righteousness is the forgiveness of God, when God reckons - imputes - or counts us as righteous by faith in Christ's blood. The word "logizomai" is translated as "counted" in Romans 4:5, as "imputed" in Romans 4:6, and as "reckoned" in Romans 4:9. Imputed righteousness is not the righteousness of another transfered to someone, neither is it the righteousness of the person it is prescribed to, but it is simply when God counts a person as righteous, when God imputes them as righteous, when God reckons or considers them as righteous. It is simply when God forgives us through the blood of Jesus Christ. This makes much more sense! I'm glad you didn't take my questions as an attack or sneaky trap, but as it was: A question needing an answer So it would be like my delcaring a foreign child as my own through adoption papers? It would be like bringing a son into my home who was previously not a son without his working for it? If thsi is what you mean, it makes perfect sense!
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Post by Jesse Morrell on Feb 3, 2008 0:17:06 GMT -5
When dealing with good hermeneutics, or sound biblical interpretation, we must analyze the meaning of original words. By looking to see how else a word is used, we are given inside into it's meaning.
So here are other cases of the Greek word "logizomai" being used in the New Testament. "Imputed" does not mean "transfered" it means "considered" "counted" or "reckoned".
Luk 22:37 "he was reckoned (logizomai) among the transgressors".
Rom 6:11 "Likewise reckon (logizomai) ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin".
Rom 8:18 "For I reckon (logizomai) that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us."
Rom 2:26 "Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted (logizomai) for circumcision?"
Rom 9:8 "but the children of the promise are counted (logizomai) for the seed."
Rom 4:8 "blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute (logizomai) sin."
The word "imputed" simply means reckoned, counted, or considered. In conjunction with the word "righteousness" we understand that "imputed righteousness" is not a transfer of someone else's character, but it is when a person is reckoned, counted, or considered righteous.
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Post by Jesse Morrell on Feb 3, 2008 0:24:46 GMT -5
Yes Dan,
Imputed righteousness is like if a man adopts a child and that child is imputed as his own son, that is, the child is considered his own son. That does not mean that the adopted child was transfered the identity of some other child, but simply that he is being imputed or counted as a genuine son.
Likewise with immigration. When an immigrant becomes an "American", they are imputed as an American, that is, they are considered to be an American. That does not mean that some other American lost their citizenship and it was given to the immigrant. Nobodies citizenship was lost or transferred. But citizenship was gained, a person was imputed an American, they were considered an American.
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Post by danlirette on Feb 3, 2008 0:41:09 GMT -5
Yes Dan, Imputed righteousness is like if a man adopts a child and that child is imputed as his own son, that is, the child is considered his own son. That does not mean that the adopted child was transfered the identity of some other child, but simply that he is being imputed or counted as a genuine son. Likewise with immigration. When an immigrant becomes an "American", they are imputed as an American, that is, they are considered to be an American. That does not mean that some other American lost their citizenship and it was given to the immigrant. Nobodies citizenship was lost or transferred. But citizenship was gained, a person was imputed an American, they were considered an American. Amen! This is a great study and I'm sincerely greatful you've shared it! I'm equally as greatful that you've explained it further! This really is good stuff!
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Post by rebecca on Feb 3, 2008 8:33:09 GMT -5
I'm really enjoying reading this thread. Thanks, Jesse.
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Post by Jesse Morrell on Feb 3, 2008 12:24:46 GMT -5
I too have thoroughly enjoyed studying this subject.
There is a pretty big difference between saying:
- We are justified and treated as righteous through the blood of the atonement (justified by grace through His blood)
- We are justified and treated as righteous through Christ's obedience to the law (justified by the works of the law)
The former says we are justified by His blood, the latter says we are justified by the law. The former says that we are counted righteous because of Christ's atonement, the latter says we are counted righteous because of Christ's obedience to the law.
Consider these verses:
Rom 5:9 "Much more then, being now JUSTIFIED BY HIS BLOOD, we shall be saved from wrath through him."
Rom 3:25 "Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through FAITH IN HIS BLOOD, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God.
Rom 3:20 "Therefore by the deeds of the law [ours or Christ's] there shall no flesh be justified in his sight"
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