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Post by rebecca01 on May 29, 2006 8:37:04 GMT -5
Truth is not relative because Jesus said that I am the way the truth and the life.God says that I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end.You cannot go outside of scripture to prove anything if you believe that.I can prove anything using my bible alone.Unbelievers want you to go outside of scripture and they will not talk to you if you use the bible as your reference because they are under conviction.
We are after lost sheep not those who say they see therefore they are blind the scripture says.If they will not have a discussion with you if you use scripture than they are in essence telling you that they already have their mind made up.
They are afraid of the bible because they know it's the truth and they are afraid of the truth.They will not come to the light lest their deeds be manifest that they are not wrought in God.If you want to have these lengthy discussions using human reasoning Im sure it won't hurt anything but you are wasting your time.
It's human reasoning and it has no basis so your just going in circles.There is nothing to back anything else up so it carries no weight.
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Post by rebecca01 on May 29, 2006 9:23:19 GMT -5
By the way, I am referring to those on this board who have told me, "...prove it but don't use scripture..." Sorry can't do that.
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Post by HSTN2983 on May 29, 2006 10:05:12 GMT -5
...so, because jesus said it two thousand years ago and it was recorded in a text manipulated by religious officials i am supposed to believe it? hardly...
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Post by rebecca01 on May 29, 2006 19:40:41 GMT -5
No, you beleive it because it's either true or it's not. If what "you" believe is true than it's not relative because it's either true from the foundation of the world or it's not.Even christians believe that things evolve but everything has to evolve from something else.The question is that everything springs forth from something and that something is not relative to anything else because it came BEFORE everything else so how can it be relative???
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Post by atheistbibleburner on May 29, 2006 20:00:21 GMT -5
THANK YOU!!!!!!
What's that?You can't do it... Although you have all of god's creation around you, you have nothing that can prove it.
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Post by rebecca01 on May 29, 2006 20:08:22 GMT -5
Did you say "Creation" Caught ya!!!
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Post by rebecca01 on May 29, 2006 20:24:34 GMT -5
The truth is that you know there is a God is my belief because the bible says that the fool says in his heart that there is no God.What that is actually saying is "of course there is a God everyone knows that".Even heathens try to create gods and thay say "these are our gods" but you hear very few say that there isn't a god unless they are just using that statement as a way of escape from the truth.They can just say there is no god so there is no need to say what your bible says because I won't believe it anyway.
The point I am trying to make here is that you are either seeking the truth or you are not.You cannot go outside of your athiestic beliefs if that is your truth and I cannot go outside of what I believe in scripture because truth is not relative.
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Post by rebecca01 on May 29, 2006 21:02:25 GMT -5
The question of all questions is "what is the truth?" Nothing else matters.There is NOTHING else in life that matters.Everything else is pointless! Everyday when you get up in the morning you have a choice whether or not you are going to be honest with yourself,that is a choice that you have.You can go through life decieving yourself if you want.Some people like to just believe the best in everything and hope that everything just works itself out in the end because they can't handle the truth.Some people don't like to pay their bills even though they are wealthy because they can't handle the pressure.Not many people like to go to the doctor because no news is good news.We could go on forever.
Life revolves around truth and we have a choice if we are going to come into the light or remain in darkness.
What is the beginning?: TRUTH!!! Truth does not hurt because Jesus is the way the truth and the life.Truth is healing because Jesus is healing.Without truth there is no cure.The fact that many will not recieve the truth even when they hear it is also a truth.It's a sad fact but a fact none the less.
I cannot go outside of scripture to prove what I believe is true and you cannot go outside of what you believe is true.There are only two types of people, the ones that know they are right and the ones who are still seeking, which group do you fall in?
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Post by atheistbibleburner on May 29, 2006 21:32:12 GMT -5
AGAIN! Circular argumentation. That's what I'm getting at. Dont use circular arguments!
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Post by rebecca01 on May 29, 2006 21:54:00 GMT -5
Because I don't believe there is any such thing as an athiest.
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Post by atheistbibleburner on May 30, 2006 0:28:21 GMT -5
You're right, there's not ^^
(j/k, its athEIst by the way)
But, believe it or not, atheists exist. That can be seen in the large atheist community demonstrated online.
And how the hell is that an excuse to use circular arguments?
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Post by rebecca01 on May 30, 2006 2:43:17 GMT -5
OK, I know, you don't read the bible because you are an athEIst- (pardon me ).Creation though is all you need to know that there is a God.
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Post by HSTN2983 on May 30, 2006 3:15:35 GMT -5
rebecca, when will you stop quoting man [ray comfort] and start actually quoting christ if you are a christian?
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Post by rebecca01 on May 30, 2006 9:06:58 GMT -5
That's exactly what I mean.Why should I try to convince an unbeliever outside of what the bible says? Christians should be circular.I could try to convince the world that there is a God through nature for instance.Why is their good and bad? Why isn't everything either good, bad or all the same? Why is their spring,summer,fall and winter?Why not just winter?Why do plants like light instead of darkness? Why can't darkness be a part of photosynthesis instead of light? How come plants grow up instead of down? Why don't they embrace the ground instead? Why when you ask people what their favorite color is noone says black? Why can't pain and dying be a good thing? How come we get upset when people suffer instead of rejoice?Why do I care about others? How come the body has a way of healing itself? Why don't we just bleed to death? Who taught the body how to heal itself? Why is love a good thing and not hate?
But even then you would not believe unless you want the truth.You have to be a truth seeker.
Jesus said, "I have come to seek and to save that which is lost." So are you lost or found? Why should I look for that which is found unless you say you are found but you are really lost.
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Post by atheistbibleburner on May 30, 2006 14:22:11 GMT -5
I don't see it, show me.
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Post by atheistbibleburner on May 30, 2006 14:32:00 GMT -5
ANOTHER CONFESSION! PRAISE ALLAH!! SAUCE BE UPON HIM!
Watch this:
Good and bad are points of view created by man. What I believe is kick - behind you may believe sucks behind.
Maybe there's someone out there who believes everything is good or everything sucks ( gothics) lol.
Those are divisions created by man. They noticed that it was slightly colder in certain parts of the year, slightly hotter in other parts. Therefore they made seasons. All of this is of course, created by the earth's revolution around the sun.
So they can get in as much sunlight as possible. Some do. Some people like black. You're making some huge generalizations.
Some people think pain and dying are good ( gothics, emos, etc. lol) Not all people get upset. Some jump for joy. I don't know, why do you? Cells work together, certain enzymes send signals to the cells to divide faster, to close it up. To grow at a faster rate. All biological processes.
Hemopheliacs(Sp?) do.
Noone did, it's a biological process, controlled by enzymes. It's a biological reaction to the environment.
Some think love sucks. Some think hate is awesome. It's all point of view.
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Post by rebecca01 on May 30, 2006 19:37:26 GMT -5
I thought you'd say that.
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Post by HSTN2983 on May 31, 2006 0:40:21 GMT -5
rebecca, i am a truthseeker. this is why i read the bible on a regular, daily basis. i also read other sacred texts. i think religion is fascinating, but often used for evil when put in the wrong hands. i try to look at all angles, and take everything in. i am not going to pray over something i do not believe in to begin with so that i may be shown the truth. that is absurd.
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Post by rebecca01 on May 31, 2006 9:06:41 GMT -5
That is why I try to speak the truth into everything I say.I don't just speak scripture.There is a God and I believe everyone knows this.I don't believe their is a such thing as atheism.The only religion in this world that makes since is christianity.Everything else has holes all through it.It really doesn't take much research to figure that out either.Most religions were started by depraved people, a bunch of fruit loops.
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Post by atheistbibleburner on May 31, 2006 11:15:36 GMT -5
HAHAHHAHAHAHHAHA! Do you even know how many things are wrong with YOUR bible? Here, I'll point you to a site that has them all marked and labeled for you. www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/What about Judaism? It's one step below christianity, same god, no christ, same first 5 books. If Judaism is wrong, then the first 5 books of the bible are wrong, therefore christianity is wrong.
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Post by atheistbibleburner on May 31, 2006 11:23:28 GMT -5
The Skeptic's Annotated Bible is intended to be a self defense manual against biblical fundamentalism. It identifies the passages that are inconsistent with the concept of biblical inerrancy, or that could not have been inspired by a benevolent god. Such passages are shown in color, with the color coding scheme and symbols shown below.
Injustice
Absurdity
Cruelty and Violence
Contradictions
Intolerance
Women
Family Values
Prophecy
Science and History
Sex
Language
Homosexuality
Interpretation
Since the Bible, particularly the King James Version, is often difficult to understand, notes have been added to clarify the meaning of the highlighted passages.
But isn't there some good stuff in the bible? Well yes there is, although surprisingly little for such a big book. Indeed, if the bad, boring, and useless passages were removed from the bible and only the good retained, the bible would be nothing more than a small pamphlet.
But bible-believers are unwilling to edit the bible. So the good verses, when not invalidated by their immediate context, are contradicted elsewhere in the bible. There is not a single good idea in the entire bible that is taught consistently. Consequently, the bible is worse than useless as a moral, philosophical, political, or scientific guide.
Still, I think it is important to point out the good stuff in the bible, and so I have highlighted the good verses and provided a "thumbs up" icon to mark them in the text.
From the SAB webpage.
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Post by HSTN2983 on May 31, 2006 12:28:10 GMT -5
why are christians continuously quoting ray comfort and other "men." they would probably make a better case for themselves if they started using the words of christ...instead of paul and others.
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Post by rebecca01 on May 31, 2006 13:56:06 GMT -5
atheistbibleburner, you are going to have to be more specific and I would be more than happy to refute every claim that the Sceptics Annotated Bible has to say.
HSTN2983, I know very little about Ray Comfort.I choose to be an individual.I could walk the ends of the earth alone and it would not phase me in the least,a matter of fact I prefer it that way which is one of my faults.
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Post by atheistbibleburner on May 31, 2006 14:00:05 GMT -5
All right, fair enough but
Can you answer that for me?
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Post by rebecca01 on May 31, 2006 15:38:13 GMT -5
Ok, I will give you a very rough draft from off the top of my head so here goes and if you want me to back it up with scripture later I can do so but I don't have the scriptures readily available at this moment.
God chose himself a people, the Jews.If I remember correctly He chose them because they were the least of all the nations and God has a way of doing this because He likes to have the glory.God wants all the glory and He will not share it with a proud people.Is this wrong? No, He's God so He's the boss.God allowed these people to fall under the bondage of Pharoah and become slaves, than He delivered them out of Pharoahs hand and told the people through Moses and Aaron that He was the great I AM and their God.Why did He let these people fall under this great bondage and into slavery? So that God could show Himself strong on their behalf and deliver them.Why?Because He is God and wants the glory.God led them through the wilderness and into the promised land flowing with milk and honey.They were a stiff necked people but God still loved them just as a Father loves his child.So much so that throughout the bible God gave clues to the jewish people about the coming Messiah.When Jesus came he said that he came not to do away with the law but to fulfill it.Jesus though became the sacrifice instead of animals for without the shedding of blood their is no remission of sins.Jesus when he was on this earth said "I have not come but for the lost house of Isreal.." Jesus came to his own but his own recieved him not the bible says.Jesus came to the Jews first and than the Gentiles even though he did not turn away the Gentiles because he even spoke with a Samaratian woman.After Jesus's resurrection the time of the Gentiles had come.The bible says "has God done away with the Jews?" God forbid.
Romans 11:25 For I would not brethren that ye should be ignorant of this mystery lest ye should be wise in your own conciets; that blindness in part happened to Isreal until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in.
The jews are partially in blindness until the Gentiles come in but not all because I hear of many Jews being saved.I believe the time of the Jews has come because we are nearing the end.I have even heard of this woman who supernaturally met a Jewish man in Isreal and God showed him in a vision who she was and when he saw her at the market place because she was a missionary there told her that many jews are being saved and to be comforted by this and went his way and she never saw him again.
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Post by HSTN2983 on May 31, 2006 15:41:25 GMT -5
god chose a people. how discriminative....
and rebecca, in reply to your response, there is no such thing as individualism.
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Post by rebecca01 on May 31, 2006 15:45:33 GMT -5
individualism : a doctrine that the interests of the individual are primary.
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Post by atheistbibleburner on Jun 1, 2006 1:31:34 GMT -5
So god picks and chooses people as he pleases? Great.
So for all you know, he chooses the atheists right now, and supports them in their firm beliefs against him, and will give them access to paradise?
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Post by HSTN2983 on Jun 1, 2006 4:18:44 GMT -5
rebecca, if you are an individual, then you have no place in christianity. individualism is like utopia--a good idea, but irrelevant to reality and impossible to attain. your thoughts and actions are all predetermined by others, and everything you do has been done before. after all, your bible teaches you that: 'nothing is new under the sun.'
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Post by rebecca01 on Jun 1, 2006 8:26:21 GMT -5
It just means that my interests are primary.My interest is God.Im not interested in being patted on the back but there is nothing wrong with a little incouragement from others just so long is it is not more important than what God thinks.
Saying that I am an individual to me means that what I think and how I feel about things and the way I react to things have to do with how God is dealing with me and it is not dictated by something else or someone else.This is the way all christians should live.
How I live is not relavent if God is in control.
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