|
Post by Jesse Morrell on Apr 1, 2009 21:38:57 GMT -5
Sin was Satan's plan. Sin was the plan of the god of Calvinism. (Read Beza). Is there a difference between Satan and the god of Calvinism? Is Satan really the enemy of God? If sin is God's plan, and if sin is Satan's plan, then the devil is not a rebel at all! The devil is doing the will of God instead of being in rebellion against God's will. In Calvinism, God does the will of the devil and the devil does the will of God!
Sin is not the plan of the God of the Bible. The God of the Bible wanted a sinless universe. God eternally decreed "thou shalt not" regarding sin. Sin is rebellion against the will of God.
|
|
|
Post by Jesse Morrell on Apr 1, 2009 21:40:07 GMT -5
Calvinism and Gnosticism are also similar. Gnostics said we are born with a sinful flesh. Calvinism says that we are born with a sinful nature.
|
|
|
Post by Jesse Morrell on Apr 1, 2009 21:54:51 GMT -5
Any theology that excuses or justifies sin is not a Biblical theology. Any preacher that excuses or justifies sin is not a preacher that speaks for God. Calvinism says that sin is God's plan. Every sin throughout all of history has been His plan according to Calvinism. This actually excuses and justifies sin. You couldn't ask for a better excuse or a better justification than the very will of God! Therefore Calvinism is not Biblical and does not speak for God!
|
|
|
Post by Jesse Morrell on Apr 1, 2009 21:57:22 GMT -5
Danny, I have no doubt that Theodore Beza, the disciple of John Calvin, was unsaved and hell bound. Listen to this blaspheming heretic: "The Fall of Man Was Both Necessary and Wonderful"
Anyone who says that sin is God's plan, or that God wanted a sinful universe instead of a sinless universe, is talking about a god that is not the Holy God of the Bible.
|
|
|
Post by Jesse Morrell on Apr 1, 2009 22:24:53 GMT -5
"The Fall of Man Was Both Necessary and Wonderful" Calvin's disciple Beza
God didn't think that sin was wonderful. Genesis 6:5-6 God repented of making man and was GRIEVED in his heart because of man's rebellion. Calvinism contradicts the Bible.
Just like the Westminster Catachism says that no man is able to perfectly keep God's commandments but doth daily break them. 1 Cor10:13 says, "you are able". The Catechism says, "no man is able". Calvinism contradicts the Bible.
A person can choose between the lies of Calvin or the truths of Christ, but you cannot have both!
|
|
|
Post by Jesse Morrell on Apr 1, 2009 22:26:21 GMT -5
Questions to help detect heresy:
- Is sin God's plan or Satan's plan? - Did God want a sinless universe or a sinful universe?
|
|
|
Post by christiansoldier on Apr 2, 2009 9:23:21 GMT -5
oh come on Jesse this is a flat out attack and nothing more, comparing Calvinism to satanism and Gnosticism. is this how Christian are suppose to treat each other? are we supposed to attack our brothers? or is it that Armenians are the only ones that are saved and Calvinist are going to hell? ridiculous! I have never heard a Methodist say that a Baptist was a satanist. give it up, God doesn't want us to fight amongst ourselves it is getting in the way of the great commission (what God actually wants us to do.)
1st John 4:20
|
|
|
Post by Jeffrey Olver on Apr 2, 2009 11:26:23 GMT -5
I know many people who are Calvinist - and love the Lord, and pursue holiness... the thing is, their wonderful pursuit of Jesus Christ is inconsistent with what they claim to believe doctrinally.
If you want a true look at where the starting point of calvinism leads, holding to it closely, take a look at the Westboro Baptist Church.
Calvinism needs to be attacked. I understand Jesse's allegory to compairing Calvinism to Satanism - seeing as sin was never in God's plans - but it IS certainly akin to gnosticism.
True, God does not want us to fight amongst ourselves. But Calvinism, followed to it's ultimate end, does not support the Great Commission.
I'll never be perfect in my mind, or body. I have the ability to make mistakes, even to choose sin over holiness. But thank God, Jesus made me morally perfect and I can continue to walk in holiness and choose to take the road of escape from temptation that God always provides.
...My 2 cents.
|
|
|
Post by boldforchrist on Apr 2, 2009 14:01:04 GMT -5
No, that was the Apostle Paul who said that. Have you ever read the book of Romans or do you throw that out of your doctrine? Once again, you can not pick and choose what parts of scripture you want to keep and what parts you want to throw out. I also do not think Calvinist promote sin or a sinful lifestyle, where do you get this info? This is absurd and to see so many who follow your line of doctrine here is disturbing.
I do not know of one single Calvinist who use their doctrine as an excuse to sin. They are for the most part, leading a holier lifestyle than most Christians. No Calvinist sins and blames it on God as His will! You can not just read some garbage on the Internet and make it into what you want.
"The god of Calvinism"?!? What is this? Are you still holding to your story of how you have not committed one single sin since you have been saved? I understand that old saying "Doctrine Divides", but this just gets silly here sometimes!
|
|
|
Post by boldforchrist on Apr 2, 2009 14:15:08 GMT -5
[quote author=jaolver board=doctrinaldiscussion thread=6656 post=68566 time=1238689583)
If you want a true look at where the starting point of Calvinism leads, holding to it closely, take a look at the Westbrook Baptist Church.
Calvinism needs to be attacked.
I'll never be perfect in my mind, or body. I have the ability to make mistakes, even to choose sin over holiness. But thank God, Jesus made me morally perfect and I can continue to walk in holiness and choose to take the road of escape from temptation that God always provides.
...My 2 cents.[/quote]
Well, your last part was correct. But, why would you think that I would know where the "Westboro Baptist Church" is? I have no idea who they are or where they are, I will guess.... "Westboro"
I know there is a ton of goofy doctrine out there and I know there are a ton of bad churches, but Armenians telling Calvinist they are going to Hell is nuts!
Where people are being led to Hell is in the "word of faith preaching", it is in the "Universal Unitarian Church", it is in the "Catholic Church", it is in many, many false preachings by false money hungry Bible teachers.
Divide away my brother, soon you shall be a cult! Pit the few truly saved Christians against each other, that is what Satan wants. Do not fall into his trap so easily. "Divide and Conquer", or "Be The Body"?
|
|
|
Post by Jesse Morrell on Apr 2, 2009 22:20:49 GMT -5
I hear Calvinists say all the time, "I am just a SINNER saved by grace" or "We all sin EVERY DAY".
Calvinists also uses excuses like:
- God's laws are impossible - We are born sinful - I am only human - Nobodies perfect etc
Who teaches that?
I wish I could say that.
But I have sinned every year since my conversion. I didn't have to, but I did. If I didn't repent, I would have perished. But when I have sinned, I have repented and ask for God's forgiveness.
|
|
|
Post by markgavin on Apr 5, 2009 19:45:07 GMT -5
You are a smart guy Jesse, and I understand what you are talking about in this post. what I have found is most God loving calvinsists hate sin. They do not practice their calvinism in real life because it is impractical. They grieve over their sin and repent. they have head knowledge and all but their life is more in line with the open theist in living. I don't think calvinists are satan lovers.
|
|
|
Post by goodtidings on Apr 5, 2009 20:29:48 GMT -5
Satanism teaches that man can do his own thing independent of God! That man can evolve and become like God!
Open theism teaches that man can influence God, based on man's wisdom! That God is open to man's ideas for his future and that all man has to do is pray and the God of heaven will allow man to shape his own future!
The two ideas expressed are the same! One is outright! The other is subtle!
Prayer is not man upward! But God downward! We are impressed to pray, and then the Holy SPirit interceeds for us, because we do not have a clue what we are doing!
Open Theism is attractive to people with pride in their own views! They love to think that they have some secret power over God and that God must in some way submit to their will!
God is Almighty! God is perfect! God does not change! God has seen the end from the beginning! THe fact is that some just will not accept the AUTHORITY of GOD!
Calvinism is the same as Satanism! It shows that we are free to live in sin! Sin is blasphemy and pure hate to GOD! It is the spirit of rebellion! Any religion that allows sin or makes room for it in their theology is hatred of the God of LAW. Law is LOVE! It is the principles of covenant relationship! When man receives the Holy SPirit, he is then free fromt he spirit of Satan which is lawlessness!
Doctrine is very important! Doctrine can be blasphemed (1 Tim 6:1). Therefore, the teachings (doctrine) we follow determine whether or not we are blaspheming God!
Sin is bad! Sin can be overcome in the flesh! Rom 8:1-4 teaches that sin is the flesh is condemned! If you are living in sin in the flesh you are lost! You have the spirit of Satan! If you have the Spirit of Christ, then you do not submit to the promptings of your carnal heart, for you have a new heart! Ez36:26-27! The problem is that most do not understand how to submit to God or have other reasons for their profession of faith! Isaiah 4:1, many profess Christ just to take away thier reproach! They want the title but not the cross to crucify the lusts of the flesh! Thus they accept the name but not the gift of grace to reform them into true followers of holiness!
Tidings!
|
|