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Post by Kerrigan on Mar 24, 2006 0:50:08 GMT -5
Micah, you said, "If the person forsakes the sin and turns back to God they are reconciled again to God. It is not getting born again over and over again." So, if I am following you right here, someone can be Born Again and go to Hell?
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Post by Kerrigan on Mar 24, 2006 0:54:12 GMT -5
Another thing...where does temporal punishment come into play in this whole scenario you seem to be painting. It seems like you are saying that someone goes from saved to unsaved each time they sin (be it once a month or once a year). What do you do with Hebrews 12:1-11 and 1 Corinthians 3:12-15?
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Post by Kerrigan on Mar 24, 2006 0:55:34 GMT -5
Just thought I would chime in...... Our minds cannot fathom the abhorrence God has towards sin. So we must rationalize, as to appease the erroneous mindset caused by false teaching, which is obviously caused by being slothful in reading and studying the Bible. Doesn't anybody study for themselves anymore? Lazy, deceived, and lukewarm american christianity. People sin because they want to sin. Bottom line. I'm getting nauseous just thinking about it. Soundoff! Thanks for chiming...
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Post by messengermicah on Mar 24, 2006 1:17:31 GMT -5
Of course someone can have a born again experience and still go to hell. If a person dies in sin they are going to hell.
1 Corinthians 3:12-15 is referring to doctrine not immorality.
Hebrews 12:1-11-Yes if someone is truly a child of God then God will chasten them when they sin so they will repent and not continue in it and end up in hell like Hebrews 10:26-31.
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Post by messengermicah on Mar 24, 2006 1:23:46 GMT -5
By the way, if I am following you right here you are saying someone can habitually sin the same sin twice a week and still be a Christian and go to heaven? So after you take people through the Ray Comfort Good person test and tell them if they have ever lied once then they are a liar, but now they are a Christian and they watch pornography twice a week they are saved from sin?
Also, about temporary punishment if you read my other post carefully, I explained that I do not know how many sins a person has to commit before they end up in hell. I live as if it is only one and preach that way, because that is what I see from the Bible. If you want to allow others to see how much they can get away with that is unwise.
Put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ and make NO PROVISION FOR THE FLESH TO FULFILL THE LUSTS THEREOF (Romans 13:14).
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Post by Kerrigan on Mar 24, 2006 1:26:35 GMT -5
Of course someone can have a born again experience and still go to hell. If a person dies in sin they are going to hell. 1 Corinthians 3:12-15 is referring to doctrine not immorality. Hebrews 12:1-11-Yes if someone is truly a child of God then God will chasten them when they sin so they will repent and not continue in it and end up in hell like Hebrews 10:26-31. WOW! Someone can be Born Again and not have to be Born Again-Again to go the Heaven? That's the first time I've heard that. I don't know how you get doctrine out of the Scripture in 1 Corinthians 3:12-15...sounds like eisegesis instead of exegesis to me. So, for the CHristian who sins, they lost their salvation and get temporal chastisement at the same time?
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Post by Kerrigan on Mar 24, 2006 1:29:06 GMT -5
By the way, if I am following you right here you are saying someone can habitually sin the same sin twice a week and still be a Christian and go to heaven? So after you take people through the Ray Comfort Good person test and tell them if they have ever lied once then they are a liar, but now they are a Christian and they watch pornography twice a week they are saved from sin? You're not following me right. I don't know why you keep going back to the twice a week thing, that was just a number that I through out there. And LIKE I SAID, I don't tell people to keep on sinning. I tell them to turn from ALL SIN and flee themselves to the foot of the blood stained cross for Mercy from the Savior. By the way, why do you keep going back to pornography?
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Post by Kerrigan on Mar 24, 2006 1:31:00 GMT -5
By the way, Micah...love ya man and I dare you...no I double dog dare you to take a stab at my "Can Someone Lose Their Salvation?" thread I just started. DOn't get scared just see what you can do with what I posted... ;D
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Post by messengermicah on Mar 24, 2006 1:39:55 GMT -5
Depends on whether or not they receive the chastisement.
I do not really appreciate how I keep repeating myself that I do not know for sure how many times one has to sin to end up in hell, and you keep insisting that is what I am insisting on. Do you want me to repeat myself again?
How many sins did it take for Adam to be kicked out of Eden? How many times did the angels have to sin to be kicked out of heaven? I am not God and I do not know how many, but I see some evidence that if a person sins once and does not repent they will die in sin and go to hell. That is exactly what I believe. Do you want me to keep repeating it?
Does not sin separate you from God? Is repentance necessary for forgiveness of sin? Well then if someone dies in sin without repenting of that sin then God will not forgive them and they will go to hell.
If someone is practicing sin, whether they were ever born again or not they are headed for hell unless they repent.
I posted many posts that questioned once saved always saved on a previous thread and you never attempted to refute any of them. Do you want to change the discussion to that topic again?
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Post by messengermicah on Mar 24, 2006 2:01:16 GMT -5
You asked why I kept going back to pornography. I also mentioned drunkeness. I could use any sin, but I have found from the experience of talking to people that sexual sin is the most prevalent sin I run into. Most of the places and people we preach to are all into sexual sin.
Many professing Christians are bound to that sin, and their outward life seems ok, but they are a slave of sin headed for hell. We live in a sex saturated society.
I keep going back to twice a week or once a week because that is habitually sinning, or practicing, or commiting sin. If it is once a month it is still a habit.
Someone who gave into a sin every few years would not be practicing sin.
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Post by tomah on Mar 24, 2006 9:24:21 GMT -5
To be honest guys, theology that assumes you are perfect in your obedience to God when it is more than slightly possible that you're not, is worse than those that strive for holiness, yet are aware of our faults. It is said of Archbishop Ussher, that there was not a holier man in the country and yet he would spend all Saturday afternoon out in the open fields, confessing and repenting of sin. The lives of McCheyne, Whitefield, Edwards, the Reformers, and a multitude of others show that even though there were not holier men in their day, they still sensed their sin before a thrice holy God.
Do you think that the seraphims of Heaven would be able to fly around you and cry "Holy, Holy, Holy..."?? Come on now guys! I recognise the Christian's need to be holy, and I believe that if we are living right, our lives will testify to true holiness of life, yet the Christian himself, even the holiest will be the most aware (except for God) of his faults and will constantly cry to God for mercy and cleansing. I have to say this through conviction of the scriptures, but if you think you are perfectly obedient to God, then you have a shallow view of the holiness of God. Even in Heaven, when we shall be totally perfect, never to sin again, i still think we shall fall down on our faces at the transcendant holiness of God.
You misunderstand the difference between the redemption of the fallen nature and the redemption of the body. Because our body is not yet fully redeemed, we have to 'mortify' our members. A work which requires hard work and effort to subdue and put to death the natural tendancies of the "body".
The key word is 'strive'. When Jesus said to the woman, "sin no more" he meant for her to 'strive' for perfection. When God says, "be ye holy" it means to strive to attain perfect holiness.
The message of Romans 7:14-25 very clear and plain on the issue of sanctification; how we engage in it (faith) and it's source (Christ). You have to twist the whole passage to suit this doctrine of sinlessness. First, it's present tense and second, it's clearly talking about sanctification, not justification.
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Post by Kerrigan on Mar 24, 2006 9:50:15 GMT -5
To be honest guys, theology that assumes you are perfect in your obedience to God when it is more than slightly possible that you're not, is worse than those that strive for holiness, yet are aware of our faults. It is said of Archbishop Ussher, that there was not a holier man in the country and yet he would spend all Saturday afternoon out in the open fields, confessing and repenting of sin. The lives of McCheyne, Whitefield, Edwards, the Reformers, and a multitude of others show that even though there were not holier men in their day, they still sensed their sin before a thrice holy God. Do you think that the seraphims of Heaven would be able to fly around you and cry "Holy, Holy, Holy..."?? Come on now guys! I recognise the Christian's need to be holy, and I believe that if we are living right, our lives will testify to true holiness of life, yet the Christian himself, even the holiest will be the most aware (except for God) of his faults and will constantly cry to God for mercy and cleansing. I have to say this through conviction of the scriptures, but if you think you are perfectly obedient to God, then you have a shallow view of the holiness of God. Even in Heaven, when we shall be totally perfect, never to sin again, i still think we shall fall down on our faces at the transcendant holiness of God. You misunderstand the difference between the redemption of the fallen nature and the redemption of the body. Because our body is not yet fully redeemed, we have to 'mortify' our members. A work which requires hard work and effort to subdue and put to death the natural tendancies of the "body". The key word is ' strive'. When Jesus said to the woman, "sin no more" he meant for her to 'strive' for perfection. When God says, "be ye holy" it means to strive to attain perfect holiness. The message of Romans 7:14-25 very clear and plain on the issue of sanctification; how we engage in it (faith) and it's source (Christ). You have to twist the whole passage to suit this doctrine of sinlessness. First, it's present tense and second, it's clearly talking about sanctification, not justification. Exactly brother! I thank God for you!
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Post by messengermicah on Mar 24, 2006 20:36:29 GMT -5
RevK,
I have answered all of your questions directly but you have avoided many of mine. Why do you never give a direct answer to many of the questions I brought up above.
I really want to know if you think someone can be a Christian, indulge in the same sin twice a week, and actually hate that sin. You have conveniently avoided my question by making statements like "Why do you keep going back to the twice a week thing? Why do you keep going back to pornography?"
You must have believed this was possible since you used it as an example. Yes or no?
I believe you are avoiding the issues I raised above.
Also I follow this board pretty closely and I never remember you posting anything about why you disagree on my point that the only proof that Jesus saves from sin is a life free from sin.
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Post by messengermicah on Mar 24, 2006 21:00:18 GMT -5
Armen,
I agree with you on how we respond to God's holiness. I am always seeking God for greater purity of heart and life. This does not mean that I commit sin or live in disobedience.
The Bible is very clear. Death does not make us holy. If we are not holy before we die, we end up in hell. There are so many scriptures to back this up.
1 John 3:3- And every man that has this hope in Him purifies himself EVEN AS HE IS PURE.
Whosoever is born of God does not commit sin (not strives not to) 1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God sins not (not strives not to) 1 John 5:18
For if we sin willfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth there remains no more sacrifice for sins (Hebrews 10:26)
Follow peace with all men and holiness without which no man shall see the Lord (Hebrews 12:14).
Not everyone that says unto me Lord Lord, shall enter into the Kingdom of heaven but he that does the will of my Father which is in heaven (Matthew 7:21) Which part is it that we cannot do? Which part is it that we cannot obey? His commandments are not grievous (1 John 5:3).
Hereby we do know that we know Him if WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. He that says he knows Him and KEEPS NOT HIS COMMANDMENTS IS A LIAR AND THE TRUTH IS NOT IN HIM (1 John 2:3-4)
Be ye (not try to be) perfect even as your Father in heaven is perfect. (Matthew 5:48)
To the end he may stablish your hearts unblameable in holiness before God, even our Father at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all his saints (1 Thessalonians 3:13). That is before He returns not after just like 1 John 3:2-3
And the very God of peace santify you wholly and I pray God your WHOLE SPIRIT AND SOUL AND BODY BE PRESERVED BLAMELESS UNTO (that is beforehand) THE COMING OF OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST. FAITHFUL IS HE THAT CALLETH YOU WHO ALSO WILL DO IT (1 Thessalonians 5:23-24)
Now unto Him that is ABLE TO KEEP YOU FROM FALLING AND PRESENT YOU FAULTLESS BEFORE THE PRESENCE OF OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST WITH EXCEEDING JOY (Jude 24).
I am going to go back and read your post again on Romans 7. I read it before but did not read it carefully and did not understand your point.
This whole thing of striving, trying but not being able to do it has no Biblical proof that I can see. God is not unjust and does not punish us for not doing something we cannot do.
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Post by messengermicah on Mar 24, 2006 21:10:19 GMT -5
Correction to the above. I was typing the verses from memory, but afterward I realized I misquoted Jude 24. It should be: Now unto Him that is able to keep you from falling and present you faultless before the presence of His glory with exceeding joy. That was a mistake not a sin.
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Post by Kerrigan on Mar 24, 2006 21:26:54 GMT -5
Micah, I was not avoiding your questions, but even if I was, you have definitely done your share of avoiding questions as well. I don't see anywhere in the Bible that a person must live a sinless life to be a Christian. I believe that a person should strive to live a life of holiness and a life of continually turning away from sin. You and me have different ideas of what "practicing sin" means. The word "practice" can obviously mean different things. I have given my example of the difference between practicing sin and committing acts of sin. To me, your view doesn't seem to line up with Scripture and to you my view doesn't seem to line up with Scripture. You said that you don't know how many sins it takes for someone to lose their salvation although you believe it may be one. I say I don't know what constitutes "practicing sin." The Bible doesn't give a numerical figure for that. So, all I can do is live for God as much as is possible and call others to do the same. The fact that I don't believe someone can lose their salvation makes my view much different from yours. I believe that when Christians commit sin, there will be temporal punishment, not eternal punishment, because that was settled on the Cross through Christ. Just like I wouldn't throw my own child into Hell, I don't think God will either...being that He is much more merciful than I am. I will however spank my child, discipline my child and train him in the way he should go. What it comes down to for me is that if a person is saved, they are saved and nothing can change that. It they live in sin or practice sin, then they never were saved period. Hope I answered all your questions.... ;D
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Post by messengermicah on Mar 24, 2006 21:34:23 GMT -5
Armen,
I read your post on Romans 7:14-25 and I agree with you that sanctification along with justification is by faith. Charles Finney would also agree with you.
I can't say I understand what point you are making about that here though, and how that would conflict with Arminian views.
I still believe Paul was speaking as a Christian of his pre salvation days.
For I was alive without the law once but when the commandment came sin revived and I died Romans 7:9
Acts 15:9 says "...purifying their hearts by faith" Real faith produces purity of heart that results in purity of life.
1 John 5:4-5 "For whatsoever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that overcomes the world even our faith." Real faith overcomes the world.
To open their eyes and to turn them from darkness to light and from the power of satan unto God that they may receive forgiveness of sins and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith which is in Me Acts 26:18 Faith produces sanctification.
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Post by messengermicah on Mar 24, 2006 21:40:40 GMT -5
RevK,
Thank you for your response. I am aware that you believe a true Christian will not practice or commit sin, but that statement you made or example you gave really surprised me.
Maybe I did but I was not aware that I avoided any of your questions. I have not responded to your post yet that you asked me to. I read through it before on the last thread, but have not re read it yet. I plan to later.
I think we also have a different idea of what sinless is.
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Post by Kerrigan on Mar 24, 2006 21:52:42 GMT -5
Micah, let me tell you what my idea of sinless is: the person has absolutely no sin in their life and never will again. That means that they no longer do things that God tells them not to do. It also means that they always do what God commands them to do. They also never offend their conscience. This means they pray as much as they should. They witness to every single person they could. They spend every penny of their money exactly the way God would want them to. They spend every second of their time exactly the way God would want them to. They always excercise the full extent of the Fruit of the Spirit. They are never impatient with anyone, never get aggravated with anyone and are always filled with love for God and their neighbor. Basically, they are just like Jesus (with the exception that they have sinned in the past). I could go on, but must go spend time with my wife, as I believe it would be sin if I didn't.... ;D
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Post by Manna on Mar 25, 2006 12:26:51 GMT -5
Greetings: Anyone give any thought to the law of " sowing and reaping?"in this context! If a person sows sin willfully, they reap the justice of God. It is a form of unjust Idoltary, saying that " God Almighty doesn't know right from wrong"
Just passing this by.. Blessed Regards..
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Post by Jules on Mar 25, 2006 16:45:04 GMT -5
wow. I'm a bit taken aback and grieved at the undertone of frustration and anger on this thread, both by those who claim to be without sin and those who don't claim to be...settle down boys! We're all on the same team, I pray. I hope I am just imagining it. I will be in prayer that the Lord will bring us into unity on this issue, and others. Because bottom line is, if there is no unity, then SOMEONE is not in step with the Spirit's leading. (could be more than one, or all of us, but the Spirit always unifies) I am guilty of this too, because I am passionate about my own convictions, but then I remember that I don't have all the answers, and maybe, just maybe, all knowing God might use someone or something to enlighten my pea brain just a tad, if He is so gracious (which He always is!) I think having an attitude of "I've arrived" and we know it all is a picture of "knowledge puffs up, love builds up" We need to build each other up, not tear each other down. I'm certainly including myself in this - but let's all be careful and seek the leading of the Spirit. We should ask ourselves, are we defending a doctrine, or are we defending the truth? Because the Truth can certainly stand alone, can't it?
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Post by messengermicah on Mar 26, 2006 0:02:58 GMT -5
Jules,
You make some good points and we agree with you. Don't worry too much though as RevK, Armen and I have talked before on here and we know we do not agree with each other on some points, but we do know we are on the same team.
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Post by messengermicah on Mar 26, 2006 0:19:29 GMT -5
RevK,
In response to what you said above about where in the bible does it say a Christian has to live a life without sin: 1 John 3:9-whosoever is born of God does not commit sin. 1 John 5:18-whosoever is born of God sins not.
I can say I do not do the things God commands me not to do and I do the things he commands me to do. I do witness to people when he asks me to. As far as I know I am a good steward with my finances. I do not have hobbies or things that waste precious time and money. My whole life is aimed at promoting the kingdom of God and bringing God glory.
Now God has never spoken to me to go on a 40 day fast (when I speak of fasting I am speaking of nothing but water for 40 days and nights). If he did I am sure he would give the grace to perform that. However, it could be that if I was walking more closely with God and was more in touch with His voice and His leading (this is possible), perhaps He would ask me to do that. Perhaps there are things He would ask of me if I was more in touch with Him. However, I seek God with my whole heart and obey what He shows me. I do not waste time, but am always seeking to better use and redeem the time. I am not always worrying and fretting over, "Maybe God wants me to do this or maybe He will ask me to do that." Years ago those thoughts would bother me but they do not anymore. My all is on the altar and for me now to live is Christ and to die is gain. I do not fear what He will ask me to do. I can say that with a pure heart before God and man.
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Post by Manna on Mar 26, 2006 0:44:51 GMT -5
Greetings folks...am simple, and humble ,wouldn't it be easier to approach the word of God, for which it is written::: that "The man Born-again of the Spirit does not sin( meaning that a Spirit born of God doesn't sin), but the flesh that sins will surely die( and has to out to death, as long as we are here in the flesh..Peter tell us to put to death the flesh.. 1 Peter 3:18 and there is a list talking about how to deal with the flesh, how do we do that? By washing of the Word of God , the Holy Spirit is the driving force behind God's word( Truth , Life , and Grace) Through God and his Word, it will convict you of sin or anything in our life that is not aligned with God's Holiness.. we have a decision when that happens, we either harden our heart against his word and find an excuse, or will we respond in obedience to His Word, it will effect the impact of the Word on our life... The Spirit of Truth will melt the wax or harden the clay...or a day that one had sinned their day of Grace away..This is truth and the same both to unbeliever and believer alike.
Blessed Regards
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Post by Jeff Fuller on Mar 26, 2006 0:46:07 GMT -5
This is the saddest part of this entire website...
The most godly Christians who have ever lived were not those who boasted about being perfect in the flesh, but those who moaned over the sinfulness of their flesh.
This whole argument, "I have sinned after being born again, but I repent and am made right again", tells me that you put your trust in your action to continuosly repent... your work makes you right. Of course, you'll tell me that it's your trust in Christ's work, but if you think relly hard about what you are saying, you are preaching that the Christian remains in a right relationship with God through the Christians works to remain in that right state... his ever increasing amount of repenting.
What you ultimately come to is a defense for sin... pride. You are better off because of something YOU have done... repentance.
Well, we are made absolutely perfect before the Law of God by the imputed righteousness of Jesus Christ. Now, that's how we are made perfect. Without holiness, no man shall see the Lord, and Jesus Christ's righteousness is given to us and thereby we are made holy. Brother, sister, you can have all the so-called "sinless perfection" you can muster up, but I would not swap the perfect righteousness that is mine in Christ for all the fleshly righteousness of all the so-called "sinless" people in the world.
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Post by Manna on Mar 26, 2006 0:59:16 GMT -5
Jeff...No, one should trust to their repentance instead of Christ Jesus, in other words those who place their tears in the place of Jesus's Blood. These are those that think that they have not repented enough, or don't feel their sins enough..Repentance doesn't renew the heart, that can be only by the regenerating grace of God.. And each person is different in repentance of different circumstances... Look at the jailor in the Acts, and Lydia.....One was terror, and the other sweet..God"s redemptive power, that points to and in Christ Jesus is perfect, his Justice is perfect...Will He not Judge rightly?
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Post by messengermicah on Mar 26, 2006 10:45:24 GMT -5
Jeff,
No one here is boasting about sinlessness. Based on some people's definition of sinlessness I would not say I am sinless. This would include RevK's definition because it includes never sinning again. Certainly I am not planning to sin, but I do not see where a Christian with a free will who I believe can lose their salvation gets to a point where they are capable of never sinning again. This does not mean they have to sin. It means they still can if they so choose.
2 Peter 3:17-You therefore, beloved, seeing you know these things before, BEWARE LEST YOU ALSO BE LED AWAY WITH THE ERROR OF THE WICKED, FALL FROM YOUR OWN STEADFASTNESS.
No point in Peter warning us of this if it is not possible to be led away with the error of the wicked and fall away.
1 Corinthians 10:12-Wherefore let him that thinks he stands take heed lest he fall. So it is definitely possible to fall. However in answer to the point of sinlessness here is the next verse.
1 Corinthians 10:13-There has no temptation taken you but such as is common to man, but God is faithful who will not suffer you to be tempted above that which you are able but will with that temptation make a way of escape that you may be able to bear it.
So if there is no temptation we are not able to overcome then we should overcome them all. If we do not it is solely our fault.
Again, I am not boasting. As I said earlier the only prove that a person is saved from sin is that they do not sin anymore. To be saved means to be saved from the power of sin as well as the penalty of sin. I am giving testimony to the power of the blood of Jesus and the sacrifice of Calvary that He is able to perform that which He has promised. He has saved me from sin. Sin has no power or authority over me.
Truly "The grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to ALL MEN teaching us that denying ungodliness and worldy lusts we should live soberly, righteously, and godly in this present evil world...Who gave Himself for us that He might redeem us from ALL INIQUITY and PURIFY unto Himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works" Titus 2:11,14
One more thought on imputed righteousness.
1 John 2:29-If you know that He is righteous, you know that every one that DOES RIGHTEOUSNESS IS BORN OF HIM.
1 John 3:7-Little children let no man deceive you: he that DOES RIGHTEOUSNESS IS RIGHTEOUS, EVEN AS HE IS RIGHTEOUS. The only proof that His righteousness has been imputed to someone is that they do and act as righteously as He does. Is this your testimony Jeff? If not then you can not claim His righteousness has been imputed to you.
This idea is all over the Bible. I believe it is only tradition that people refuse to believe otherwise.
1 John 2:6-He that says He abides in Him ought himself also so to walk EVEN AS HE WALKED
1 John 3:6-Whosoever abides in Him sins not. Whosoever sins has not seen Him neither known Him.
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Post by messengermicah on Mar 26, 2006 10:49:04 GMT -5
RevK,
You can disregard part of my last post to you on 1 John 3:9, 1 John 5:18. We have already discussed that and you have let me know what you think they mean, so no point in continuing with that. I am sorry and am not trying to exacerbate the situation. I think everything between us is ok but I guess others think we are in strife.
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Post by Kerrigan on Mar 26, 2006 12:58:46 GMT -5
This is the saddest part of this entire website... The most godly Christians who have ever lived were not those who boasted about being perfect in the flesh, but those who moaned over the sinfulness of their flesh. This whole argument, "I have sinned after being born again, but I repent and am made right again", tells me that you put your trust in your action to continuosly repent... your work makes you right. Of course, you'll tell me that it's your trust in Christ's work, but if you think relly hard about what you are saying, you are preaching that the Christian remains in a right relationship with God through the Christians works to remain in that right state... his ever increasing amount of repenting. What you ultimately come to is a defense for sin... pride. You are better off because of something YOU have done... repentance. Well, we are made absolutely perfect before the Law of God by the imputed righteousness of Jesus Christ. Now, that's how we are made perfect. Without holiness, no man shall see the Lord, and Jesus Christ's righteousness is given to us and thereby we are made holy. Brother, sister, you can have all the so-called "sinless perfection" you can muster up, but I would not swap the perfect righteousness that is mine in Christ for all the fleshly righteousness of all the so-called "sinless" people in the world. Amen Jeff...glad you're here brother...
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Post by Jeff Fuller on Mar 26, 2006 21:55:34 GMT -5
You asked me, "The only proof that His righteousness has been imputed to someone is that they do and act as righteously as He does. Is this your testimony Jeff?"
To your question I answer, absolutely, "NO!" There is nothing righteous of what I have done or will do, all my righteousness is found in what Christ has done in me through the power of the Spirit and the proof of that imputed righteousness is not found in the work I do, yet in the work He continues to do. He gave me the faith to believe, He gave me the will to repent, He gave me a new nature that wars against my flesh... the focus should never be on what I do to attain holiness, yet intead the focus is on Him, Christ Jesus. Anything less is human pride.
The right manner of growth is to grow less in one's own eyes. —Thomas Watson
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