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Post by pentecostalpower on Aug 26, 2007 23:26:37 GMT -5
Young man (Dan) I don't believe the Holy Ghost would have you speak in such a manner to a sister in Christ. You are out of line in your speech. You need to humble yourself before the Lord and repent. This is not love of the brethren. You may believe what you will and yet I stand on my statement. I have said many things in the past which were in the flesh, so to speak, as all have...I have also said things, as many here have, whcih were in the Spirit or birthed from a grieved heart. This is that time and I will not pay heed to your words, runner4Jesus, as your words bear no weight with what I sense from the posts I have read from rebecca. As I write this now I sense the Spirit of God bringing to my remembrance the words of Jesus concerning children and confirming my heart in what I have said concerning you, rebecca, in being blinded of devils in your belief in this area. You cannot find many statements from me anywhere where I say, "thus saith the Lord" or "I believe this is from the Lord". I will say, here and now, however, that as I write I sense the Spirit of God upon me and He is not calling me to repent, runner4Jesus, as you have asked me to do...rather I sense the Spirit of God calling me to openly challenge this devil with the Word of God who has lied to rebecca and I will do so as I am led, not as you prefer or ask; taunts of not loving the brethren go unheard; open rebuke is better than secret love. Proverbs 27:5 Open rebuke is better than secret love. I will obey the promptings of God and pay no heed to your words, as they are the words of the friends of Job. As I write I am given, directly by the Spirit of God, the remembrance of the words of Jesus Christ, and I post them here as I feel prompted to do so by the Spirit of God, and I will close this topic of babies sinning when they cry (which teaching only devils would whisper in one's ear) with this: Matthew 19:13-15 Then were there brought unto him little children, that he should put his hands on them, and pray: and the disciples rebuked them. But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven. And he laid his hands on them, and departed thence. Mark 10:13-15 And they brought young children to him, that he should touch them: and his disciples rebuked those that brought them. But when Jesus saw it, he was much displeased, and said unto them, Suffer the little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God. Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall not enter therein. Luke 18:15-17 And they brought unto him also infants, that he would touch them: but when his disciples saw it, they rebuked them. But Jesus called them unto him, and said, Suffer little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God. Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child shall in no wise enter therein.
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Post by rebecca on Aug 26, 2007 23:43:47 GMT -5
Just thought I would check in. Don't worry runner4jesus, weve been round before LOL!!! Dan's a great brother whom I love dearly ;D. Im so glad your back on the board Dan. It sure gets boring without you!
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Post by pentecostalpower on Aug 26, 2007 23:48:03 GMT -5
Just thought I would check in. Don't worry runner4jesus, weve been round before LOL!!! Dan's a great brother whom I love dearly ;D. Im so glad your back on the board Dan. It sure gets boring without you! I didn't type what I did to stir things up or cause debate; as far as I am concerned I wrote what I felt led to write as the Spirit of God was on me. Evenings like these are rare for me in the sense of sensing the Heart of God on what another says or does as I have this evening. I almost want to delete my posts but I know it would be wrong to do so and at the Judgment the Lord will hold accountable you and I both for our words. I will let them stand as they are. With that, you're a great sister also; and I certainly enjoy your presence on the Board.
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Post by rebecca on Aug 26, 2007 23:52:09 GMT -5
I really meant that by the way...
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Post by rebecca on Aug 27, 2007 3:06:22 GMT -5
I added a few more verses, here they are again:
Psalm 58:3 (King James Version) 3The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies.
Isaiah 48:8 (King James Version) 8Yea, thou heardest not; yea, thou knewest not; yea, from that time that thine ear was not opened: for I knew that thou wouldest deal very treacherously, and wast called a transgressor from the womb.
Hosea 9:11 As for Ephraim, their glory shall fly away like a bird, from the birth, and from the womb, and from the conception.
Hosea 9:16-17 (King James Version)
16Ephraim is smitten, their root is dried up, they shall bear no fruit: yea, though they bring forth, yet will I slay even the beloved fruit of their womb.
17My God will cast them away, because they did not hearken unto him: and they shall be wanderers among the nations.
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Post by rebecca on Aug 27, 2007 9:53:45 GMT -5
One other thing I wanted to add here is that children are sanctified by thier parents. We wash them by prayer and obedience to God. They observe us in the womb and outside of the womb. I pray for my children when I am pregnant and my husband reads to them. I play worship music and sing to them and I can feel the spirit of God ministering to them. They kick more when I sing and any christian mother will tell you that. John the baptist was filled with the spirit in his mothers womb. At the same token a baby can be filled with something not of God just as they are able to be filled with God's spirit.
1 Corinthians 7:14 (King James Version) 14For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.
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Post by rebecca on Aug 27, 2007 10:38:13 GMT -5
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Post by pentecostalpower on Aug 27, 2007 11:46:22 GMT -5
Rebecca, you're applying Scripture to babies that are never in context meant for babies.
This is called Isegesis.
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Post by joem on Aug 27, 2007 14:31:19 GMT -5
Dan,
Don't feel that it is your job instruct the ladies here on correct interpretation and hermeneutics, it is not your duty.
1Cr 14:34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but [they are commanded] to be under obedience, as also saith the law.
1Cr 14:35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.
Let them learn and contend with their husbands and submit the authorities they are under. If the husband does not rightly divide the word, he will be held accountable as the head of the household. You can simply speak the truth and let it fall where it may. I have learned in the past not to debate the opposite sex (unless it is my wife). I thank God for the ladies here and out of respect for them and their husbands, we should tread lightly.
Grace and Peace, Joe
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Post by pentecostalpower on Aug 27, 2007 14:57:17 GMT -5
Thank you, Joem. Your exhortation is well received, Brother.
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Post by rebecca on Aug 27, 2007 18:18:46 GMT -5
joem
Hmmmm, if I agreed with you would you say the same thing? Were not in the church and I asked my husband and he said;
"...of course babies sin.." Plus, Im not asking you the Lord has already spoken to me.
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Post by rebecca on Aug 27, 2007 18:21:19 GMT -5
joem
I thought you said you do not feel it's your job to teach a woman???
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Post by rebecca on Aug 27, 2007 18:22:55 GMT -5
joem Uh Oh! ANOTHER!
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Post by rebecca on Aug 27, 2007 18:42:56 GMT -5
...If he should stand up for the wrong, The right he’d not defend; If he should stand up for the right, The wrong he would offend. His mouth is closed, he cannot speak For freedom or against. Great God deliver us from A preacher on the fence.
But soon both sides will find him out And brand him as a fraud, A coward who dares not to please The devil or his God. Oh God, free us from fear of man, From cowardly pretence; Cleanse out the dross and fear of loss, And keep us off the fence.
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Post by pentecostalpower on Aug 27, 2007 18:57:16 GMT -5
be nice to joem
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Post by joem on Aug 27, 2007 19:03:33 GMT -5
joem I thought you said you do not feel it's your job to teach a woman??? Actually, I just found out that runner4jesus was female today. Also, I never stated that is was not my job to teach a woman. I am preacher, meeting all the qualifications laid down in scripture, and teach women every time I preach. What I did say, is that I do not think it wise to debate with women, especially concerning theological issues. If you debate with your husband or pastor, you are dealing with the authorities placed over you. I am neither your pastor, nor your husband, and have no interest in debating with you, which is why I have not addressed you directly in this thread. Grace and Peace, Joe
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Post by rebecca on Aug 27, 2007 19:08:17 GMT -5
joem
You didn't answer the question. If I agreed with you would you still have told Dan not to talk to me??? Also , do you have a problem with your PM box, or do you not prayerfully consider what you post "BROTHER".
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Post by runner4jesus on Aug 27, 2007 19:15:08 GMT -5
Joem: I find this rather comical. It's been quite a blessing to have biblical discussion intelligently and knowledgeably. Teaching the scriptures is not limited to men. One evening I was blessed to teach on Moses tabernacle to the congregation. It is legalistic to say women cannot teach, speak, or be used of God. Let me share a verse with you.
Galatians 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
My husband Tim & I have been corresponding with you all. It's been a blessing.
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Post by runner4jesus on Aug 27, 2007 19:16:50 GMT -5
Your poem Rebecca is beautiful and so aptly said. Fence sitters will fall off eventually on one side or the other. It's better to be on the LORD'S SIDE... PRAISE GOD...
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Post by runner4jesus on Aug 27, 2007 19:21:02 GMT -5
Thanks, Rebecca, signed up for that inspirational email. That will be a blessing.
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Post by rebecca on Aug 27, 2007 19:22:33 GMT -5
You have much to learn about what it means to be a pastor and who is the church PASTOR because you say you are not my pastor but we are the church. Furthermore, it does not matter what your title is if you feel I am sinning than PM me and Dan. You obviously have no care for me. Love does not behave like you have, therefore I am glad you are not my pastor. My pastor would have sent me a PM or spoke to me privately.
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Post by rebecca on Aug 27, 2007 19:25:43 GMT -5
joem
That remains to be seen.
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Post by rebecca on Aug 27, 2007 19:27:51 GMT -5
James 4:17 (King James Version) 17Therefore to him that knoweth to do good, and doeth it not, to him it is sin.
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Post by pentecostalpower on Aug 27, 2007 19:33:26 GMT -5
the heat has gotten hotter.
Now, back to babies being born in sin.
(smiles big)
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Post by Kerrigan on Aug 27, 2007 19:42:04 GMT -5
You have much to learn about what it means to be a pastor and who is the church PASTOR because you say you are not my pastor but we are the church. Furthermore, it does not matter what your title is if you feel I am sinning than PM me and Dan. You obviously have no care for me. Love does not behave like you have, therefore I am glad you are not my pastor. My pastor would have sent me a PM or spoke to me privately. How about we ALL get back to the topic at hand!
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Post by runner4jesus on Aug 27, 2007 19:45:50 GMT -5
Hello everyone, men & women alike. What this all boils down to is, we should go back to how Eli explained what the bible teaches on Adam and why we are in Adam. He explained this so well. Romans 5 declares what the truth is, if you don't agree with Eli. Bible TRUTH should be sufficient. For a while there, it looked like the truth was coming forth. Now we're in a fickle again. Accept what God has to say in Romans 5, instead of what the philosopher's say. What they say should not take preeminence to God's Word. Let God be true and every man a liar. Romans 3:4
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Post by pentecostalpower on Aug 27, 2007 20:07:43 GMT -5
we should go back to how Eli explained... Sister, I agree, for the most part, with Eli, as everyone here does, I believe, with the possible exception of Jesse, as Eli pointed out, though we'll let Jesse give his understanding as well.
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Post by Josh Parsley on Aug 27, 2007 20:09:30 GMT -5
Josh, In the passages you posted, do you believe that is is the actual sin being passed from man to Christ or from man to goat, or just the condemnation of the sin? What do you mean by the word condemnation? I may or may not agree with you.
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Post by joem on Aug 27, 2007 20:20:49 GMT -5
Josh, In the passages you posted, do you believe that is is the actual sin being passed from man to Christ or from man to goat, or just the condemnation of the sin? What do you mean by the word condemnation? I may or may not agree with you. Taking on the responsibility of making restitution for the sin such as the satisfaction of a judicial mandate, but not becoming guilty of the sin itself as a transgressor of the law so that the actual transgressor is not forgiven, but made innocent. For instance, if I get a ticket and you pay my fine, you took on the burden yet it remained my transgression. Grace and Peace, Joe
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Post by joem on Aug 27, 2007 20:29:21 GMT -5
Mat 18:32 Then his lord, after that he had called him, said unto him, O thou wicked servant, I forgave thee all that debt, because thou desiredst me:
Mat 18:33 Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee?
Mat 18:34 And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him.
Had the king taken on the debt as his own so that the debt was no longer the servants to pay, he could not have later required the servant to pay his debt due to his wicked actions. He was forgiven, yet because of his later transgression, he was in debt for the full amount and the forgiveness was withdrawn. This is a good example of what I mean. Taking on the burden of the debt is different than becoming the debtor.
Grace and Peace, Joe
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